Immaculate and Flawless prices in free fall mode.

angpin said:
Still can't find a decent Jordan auto in the $800-1000k price range (I can for $1000k but then again I could buy a couple of houses for that, lol)….the usual crap, yes. But a decent one I haven't found. Please Dan let me know were you saw them because I wouldn't mind picking up a couple. :thumbsup:
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Depends what's your definition of "decent"..... I am guessing Bulls uni, on card auto, highend product, numbered?
 
LuckySlayer said:
I myself haven't had any iMac/flawless quality issues but have had other panini products pulled in bad condition.

Sadly I missed exquisite, but many collectors have told me similar condition issues happened the odd time with them too.
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Have a look at the thread and you will see what QC issues there are, I myself have a few with these issues. I was the when UD released Exquisite and never had QC issues at this level, or never seen so much of it. Pretty piss poor for their highend products.
 
ozballer23 said:
Have a look at the thread and you will see what QC issues there are, I myself have a few with these issues. I was the when UD released Exquisite and never had QC issues at this level, or never seen so much of it. Pretty piss poor for their highend products.
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Yes definitely, I actually argee with you in you thread lol
When you paying for high end you want mint!! No doubt there.
 
LuckySlayer said:
Yes definitely, I actually argee with you in you thread lol
When you paying for high end you want mint!! No doubt there.
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Not saying that this will cause the end of the Immac and Flawless empire, but it doesn't help their prices when cards are coming out of packs in that condition. Something for Panini to learn from for future highend products.
 
hawkfandan said:
Sure thing.

Here's one in a Bulls uni - sold for $425. Wish I'd seen this one myself.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/2008-09-SP-Rookie-Threads-Michael-Jordan-Authorization-Autograph-Auto-Bulls-/291067865795?pt=US_Basketball&hash=item43c4ff2ac3&nma=true&si=EnLzXaMGK0V6KjgfYGeIMbEIwNo%3D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557


Best offer accepted for less than $750.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/MICHAEL-JOR...14868251?pt=US_Basketball&hash=item258927ab1b

Not a single bid.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/2004-05-ULTIMATE-SIGNATURES-AUTO-MICHAEL-JORDAN-/380822651203?pt=US_Basketball&hash=item58aacc81

Ultimate Collection auto in a Bulls auto, although myself - I'd break it out of the slab (not a slab guy).

http://www.ebay.com/itm/2003-UD-Ultimate-Collection-Michael-Jordan-Signed-AUTO-Bulls-HOF-PSA-8-NM-MT-/380829114003?pt=US_Basketball&hash=item58ab2f1e93&nma=true&si=EnLzXaMGK0V6KjgfYGeIMbEIwNo%3D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

BGS 9.5 Greats of the game - Not in a Bulls uni, but still a pretty sweet card - especially considering the price.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Michael-Jordan-Auto-2013-UD-All-Time-Greats-Signatures-BGS-9-5-/161216658852?pt=US_Autographed_Trading_Cards&hash=item258942fda4&nma=true&si=EnLzXaMGK0V6KjgfYGeIMbEIwNo%3D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557


Another beauty, sold for less than $800 although I can't tell how much under $800.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/MICHAEL-JOR...33198802?pt=US_Basketball&hash=item27de4b42d2


03/04 UD Glass - sold for less than $600.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/MICHAEL-JORDAN-2003-04-UD-UPPER-DECK-GLASS-AUTO-FOCUS-AUTOGRAPH-AUTO-CARD-/171233039849?pt=US_Basketball&hash=item27de48d5e9&nma=true&si=EnLzXaMGK0V6KjgfYGeIMbEIwNo%3D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

I can keep going in you'd like? These are just from the first two pages of completed listings. I don't think any of the above qualify as 'usual crap' do you? I'd say these are pretty decent, but maybe our definitions of decent are different. :thumbsup:
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Sorry our definition of "decent" does vary, but thanks for your research. :thumbsup: I think Norm summed it up…..Bulls Uni, on card and numbered.
 
LuckySlayer said:
I myself haven't had any iMac/flawless quality issues but have had other panini products pulled in bad condition.

Sadly I missed exquisite, but many collectors have told me similar condition issues happened the odd time with them too.
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Yes, there were condition issues with Exquisite, but more so in the 08/09 series, whereas the earlier seasons were all fine. But even in the 08/09 series it is not as bad as Panini.
 
angpin said:
Sorry our definition of "decent" does vary, but thanks for your research. :thumbsup: I think Norm summed it up…..Bulls Uni, on card and numbered.
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Fair enough - we're all entitled to our opinion. Good luck with your collection -I look forward to seeing your pickups!
 
LuckySlayer said:
I myself haven't had any iMac/flawless quality issues but have had other panini products pulled in bad condition.

Sadly I missed exquisite, but many collectors have told me similar condition issues happened the odd time with them too.
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I don't recall quality issues with Exqusite, but I do recall the occasional collation issues, i.e. people being shorted hits. That can happen with any product, but maybe people were just more vocal because it was Exquisite.
 
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Most of the Flawless jumbo patches I picked up have chipping on the top where the players heads are. So not only was the design poor to cut off EVERY SINGLE head, but that's also where they chip. Panini....

The prices did also tumble, got a couple Durants for $200+, but one for low $100s. Haven't seen any since though, so they are drying up and prices might rise a bit. I'm keeping all mine anyway.
 
hairyangryfella said:
Most of the Flawless jumbo patches I picked up have chipping on the top where the players heads are. So not only was the design poor to cut off EVERY SINGLE head, but that's also where they chip. Panini....
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Adding to the rediculous cut-off heads.. I'd estimate 10% of the 'Flawless' jumbo patch windows were cut off-centre.
Add that to the probably 5% of the base card stones being off centre.
There was also a fair amount of ink smudging on many of the ruby cards around the lettering too.
Some of the 1/1 patches were worse than the #/10/15/20 patches
Most of the Jumbo #/15/20 patches were a lot more kik-ass that the #/5/10 patches..!!??!!? whats with that (oh and yeah, 25% were upside down!!)

That product, for what it claimed to be, was no-where near 'Flawless'.
 
hawkfandan said:
Great point, I hadn't even thought of that. LOL
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dont think panini ever claimed the "flawless" product was actually flawless. they just named it flawless, same as immaculate
or threads, are all the cards made out of threads?? signatures??? not all the cards are signed... brilliance?? it certainly aint that..
did you prefer preferred?? find intrigue intriguing??

off subject yes... but my PC player has been pretty stable in price, down i little. could come dowm more. heh.
 
When marketing a product, you utilise key-words to evoke feelings in the consumer to attract them to the product.

They release a product entitled 'Flawless' and attach a price-tag that out-does every product before it.
If the Panini insisted on marketing the product under the name 'Flawless' they dropped the ball and did sub-par job in quality control.

Of course I agree that they can't produce each card absolutely perfect..

BUT THEY DAMN WELL SHOULD HAVE FOR $2k PER BOX!!!
 
hawkfandan said:
I don't recall quality issues with Exqusite, but I do recall the occasional collation issues, i.e. people being shorted hits. That can happen with any product, but maybe people were just more vocal because it was Exquisite.
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I opened quite a few cases of the stuff. And there were issues. One set had a few bent cards.

The 08/09 had issues with the boxes the cards were packaged in causing damage to corners if cards.
 
M4YH3M1 said:
When marketing a product, you utilise key-words to evoke feelings in the consumer to attract them to the product.

They release a product entitled 'Flawless' and attach a price-tag that out-does every product before it.
If the Panini insisted on marketing the product under the name 'Flawless' they dropped the ball and did sub-par job in quality control.

Of course I agree that they can't produce each card absolutely perfect..

BUT THEY DAMN WELL SHOULD HAVE FOR $2k PER BOX!!!
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i defiantly agree the QC was well below what it should have been especially for the price tag.
but when people say flawless should be flawless and so on. it makes me smirk a little.
 
sacface said:
i defiantly agree the QC was well below what it should have been especially for the price tag.
but when people say flawless should be flawless and so on. it makes me smirk a little.
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I agree!

If they wanted it that way, they really needed to get each and every card graded and slabbed BGS10, then pack it out. If it did not reach the grade then it needs to be destroyed and remade.

Now that would be a "Flawless" product.

But even then, I am sure there will be someone who will pick at something.........un-Flawless player selection (especially when they are missing Jordan in anything, and then missing the Autographs of a few greats and super stars).
 
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