Fleer Retro thoughts so far

I'm not comparing Jordan to Lebron and vise versa, but what is it with people comparing players from different eras?

Why does a Ferrari from today sell for more than one from 15 or 20 years ago? Maybe more fans and collectors of Ferrari in the year 2012?

You gotta like to collect a particular player in order to wanna buy a card. Doesn't mean because card X sold for this much, now card Y MUST sell for the sale or much higher. It get doesn't work that way. Not attacking you or anything, just saying.

I see people all the time saying, oh wow look what this sold for, that must mean 90's inserts will go up now, and SHOULD/MUST be worth more!!! Who said people today like to collect Toni Kukoc, or Luc Longly, and yes, even Jordan. Sure people today hear on a daily basis how great Jordan is.............. but i've heard how great Babe Ruth was, and how great Bill Russell was, and how great Bruce Lee was(haha), but do I go out of my way to collect them? No.

You gotta like a particular player on the card in order to want to collect him, imo.

There are way more NBA fans today then there was 10, 15 and 20 years ago.... also many people from back then are long out of the hobby, we didn't have forums back then so we couldn't meet people who loved to do the same thing as us, so people tend to leave something when they don't have friends that do the same stuff. Me, I stayed collecting, but is that really the case for most people?

Then you thrown in all the great martketing the NBA has done in recent years bringing the NBA WORLDWIDE!!! It's bigger than ever before. Then you add all these forums where we can meet people and stay in touch talking cards and all that good stuff...... and BAM!!! you have life long collectors, or people who take breaks knowing they could come back later and most their buddieis, if not all, will still be there to chat with about the hobby they love.

So yeah, you can't compare something from today, with something a million years ago, of a different player, no matter how good that playe was. Better player doesn't mean more collectors. Just think about it.

Also, these are not re-makes of the real thing. These ARE PMG's of Lebron, and other players who never had one. So now 20 years from now when they make a PMG of Dicky Wilson... what, it's going to be a reprint or something? No, it will be a PMG of that player. If you can say this for this set, you can say it for any set out there.




Guys.... this guy is the biggest hypocrite and loser the hobby has ever known. He is on Blowout Cards as SportsItUpCards and has been banned from multiple forums. He is known to make many fake ID's and pose as someone else.

Stay away and take ANYTHING he says with a grain of salt. He has absolutely no credibility and has no idea what he's talking about.
 
Fleer Retro's are a positive thing for the hobby as it gives a good breath of fresh air with the re-introduction of Inserts as being the hottest hits. A step away from the usual Game Auto Patches which has been over-saturated for many years now.

HOWEVER, the prices you are seeing currently on the Retro products are hyped and shilled to the max. Don't believe the prices you see. They are in demand right now but I have not a single doubt prices will drop down and level off in the coming days.


If you've been following/watching Jordan Retro PMG's like I have, you will see that EVERY single auction had and continues to have the same group of private and low feedback bidders that bombard the auctions with high bids the instant they are live. All the old ones and the newly listed ones. Especially these guys:


c***c ( private )
e***f ( private )
i***e ( private )
u***u ( 20 )


Just look at every Jordan PMG Auction live right now:


http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-53200-19255-0/1?campid=5337015507&customid=&toolid=10001&mpre=http://www.ebay.com/itm/320979668155

http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-53200-19255-0/1?campid=5337015507&customid=&toolid=10001&mpre=http://www.ebay.com/itm/320982522439

http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-53200-19255-0/1?campid=5337015507&customid=&toolid=10001&mpre=http://www.ebay.com/itm/330791615875

http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-53200-19255-0/1?campid=5337015507&customid=&toolid=10001&mpre=http://www.ebay.com/itm/390468471272

http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-53200-19255-0/1?campid=5337015507&customid=&toolid=10001&mpre=http://www.ebay.com/itm/330793674891


Look at the COMPLETED Auctions of Jordan Retro PMG's. They're also shilled and won by the same ID's. What gives?


http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-53200-19255-0/1?campid=5337015507&customid=&toolid=10001&mpre=http://offer.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewBids&_trksid=p2047675.l2565&rt=nc&item=170907172512

http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-53200-19255-0/1?campid=5337015507&customid=&toolid=10001&mpre=http://offer.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewBids&_trksid=p2047675.l2565&rt=nc&item=251147466267

http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-53200-19255-0/1?campid=5337015507&customid=&toolid=10001&mpre=http://offer.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewBids&_trksid=p2047675.l2565&rt=nc&item=300775585988



Also, the Blue PMG that "supposedly" sold for $10k this morning SCREAMS fake sale.

http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-53200-19255-0/1?campid=5337015507&customid=&toolid=10001&mpre=http://offer.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewBids&_trksid=p2047675.l2565&rt=nc&item=320979668155

Just look at the winning bidder and the 2nd highest bidder.

e***i ( 251 ) <- the same winner that backed out the Lebron 23/50 PMG Blue at $12k BIN and Jordan PMG Blue /50 at $8k BIN.
y***g ( 0 )

And look at the bid retractions in the auction:

e***i ( 251 ) Retracted: US $8,100.00
Explanation: Entered wrong amount Bid: Sep-11-12 06:40:27 PDT
Retracted: Sep-12-12 10:14:49 PDT

c***c ( private ) Retracted: US $8,300.00
Explanation: Entered wrong amount Bid: Sep-12-12 08:02:38 PDT
Retracted: Sep-12-12 08:04:15 PDT

c***c ( private ) Retracted: US $8,100.00
Explanation: Entered wrong amount Bid: Sep-12-12 08:04:28 PDT
Retracted: Sep-12-12 08:07:27 PDT

He retracts his $8,100.00 bid 2 days into the auction when he has no problem bidding past $10k? This guy has 17 bid retractions and has done the same with other PMG Jordans. Bidding high, retracting, then bidding high again and again. Winning and backing out.

Very odd and I wouldn't be surprised if the sale isn't real. And the other PMG Blue that sold for $8k BIN, re-listed and up to $8k again with the same set of shill bidders with low and private feedbacks is hardly real too.



So... yes a lot of the Retro's are indeed selling for high but be careful. There's a LOT of foul play that's going on and it's obvious if you just do a bit of research. There's NO way a RETRO PMG Jordan should be selling for more than the ORIGINALS that is far far rarer and more coveted than any modern card.



In addition to these ^... I found more shilled/re-listed Retro PMG's.


Retro PMG BLUE Jordan #'d 20/50 - Fake Sale. Re-listed by same seller.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/360486012149

http://www.ebay.com/itm/350604521507


Retro PMG RED Jordan #'d 71/150 - Fake Sales. Re-listed 3 times by same seller.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/140850934800

http://www.ebay.com/itm/170907172512

http://www.ebay.com/itm/170911511575


Retro PMG RED Jordan #'d 29/150 - Fake Sale. Re-listed by same seller.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/370647563550

http://www.ebay.com/itm/370652216265


Retro PMG RED Jordan #'d 116/150 - Fake Sale. Re-listed by same seller.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/261098027364

http://www.ebay.com/itm/261099946911
 
Why can't these people shill up the prices of DeJuan Blair cards???? GRRRRR

Then I could sell up and make a FORTUNE!! hahaha
 
In addition to these ^... I found more shilled/re-listed Retro PMG's.


Retro PMG BLUE Jordan #'d 20/50 - Fake Sale. Re-listed by same seller.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/360486012149

http://www.ebay.com/itm/350604521507


Retro PMG RED Jordan #'d 71/150 - Fake Sales. Re-listed 3 times by same seller.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/140850934800

http://www.ebay.com/itm/170907172512

http://www.ebay.com/itm/170911511575


Retro PMG RED Jordan #'d 29/150 - Fake Sale. Re-listed by same seller.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/370647563550

http://www.ebay.com/itm/370652216265


Retro PMG RED Jordan #'d 116/150 - Fake Sale. Re-listed by same seller.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/261098027364

http://www.ebay.com/itm/261099946911


So you are here posting 'proof of shilling' on the new Retro stuff, but you yourself seem to be caught up in a LOT of discussion about shady practices on eBay.

Seems like a Pot/Kettle type scenario to me!

http://www.blowoutcards.com/forums/basketball/363963-legit-jordan-pmg-6400-a.html

http://www.blowoutcards.com/forums/basketball/251631-jordan-pmg-039-100-a.html

http://www.blowoutcards.com/forums/basketball/343151-rare23air83-again.html
 
Hey don't blame me if you follow a crap team, crap teams are bound to have crap players.
Feel free to switch over to MY Bucks, the 1971 NBA Champions!
images


Did they even have newspapers back in 1971???
 
So you are here posting 'proof of shilling' on the new Retro stuff, but you yourself seem to be caught up in a LOT of discussion about shady practices on eBay.

Seems like a Pot/Kettle type scenario to me!

http://www.blowoutcards.com/forums/basketball/363963-legit-jordan-pmg-6400-a.html

http://www.blowoutcards.com/forums/basketball/251631-jordan-pmg-039-100-a.html

http://www.blowoutcards.com/forums/basketball/343151-rare23air83-again.html


Please go and read the entire thing. You will see there is absolutely NO shady practices that I have done EVER. It's the same 3 guys on BO that bad mouth me and the ENTIRE 90's Jordan market.

The first two threads are talking about a card I purchased on eBay with a quick BIN as the $6.4k price tag was cheap for a 97-98 PMG Red Jordan. Guess what, I was scammed and I got my money back from Paypal. I even left that seller a negative feedback to warn others.

http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback2&userid=jansenray&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2776

He has 3 negative feedbacks now with a bunch of scams. I was a VICTIM. So tell me how I did anything shady there.


Now regarding the last thread you posted... it's the same guy Giovanni Azzarelli who has it out for the entire 90's Jordan market. He has bad mouthed me since the very beginning when I posted the $18.25k sale of my 1st Gold Embossed Refractor Jordan BGS 9.5 card Serial #'d 32/74. It was sold to Sir_Lanner, a high end Jordan collector out in the East Coast. I posted proof of sale, Paypal payment receipt, Bank Account transfer, Delivery Confirmation, etc. etc. Still he called it a fake sale and me a scammer. He still does to this day. You should have seen how FURIOUS he was. At first, I didn't understand how anyone could just blatantly call anyone a scammer with no proof, but I later found out by MANY members on various forums that he is delusional and absolutely hates 90's Jordan sellers. That explained alot and if you actually read all of his posts, anyone can see right through this.


Anyways, I was able to get another Gold Embossed Refractor Jordan Serial #'d 54/74 which I sold privately to Nat Turner. Maybe you've heard of him. A millionaire collector that obtains the best of the best. Well the Gold Embossed Refractor was one of the last ones he needed in his collection. He purchased MINE and nybeamo's BGS 9.5 copy at the same time. He explained over at BO that he bought two so he could physically see which one had LESS Fading/Greening, choose the best and sell the extra.

A week or two later after I sold mine to him, I saw it listed on eBay in an open auction. Surprised, I immediately emailed Nat asking if for whatever reason I was to bid and win it at a LOWER price than what I sold it to him... if he'd honor it? He said yes so I started bidding. I already had a set price in mind to bid up so that's exactly what I did. I ended up losing as the buyer ended up winning it for over $15k. BTW, I have saved emails between me and Nat with this same exact conversation that will match the time and date of the whole situation.


So again... NONE, ZERO, ZILCH, absolutely NO shady business have I done with anything. Just look at my feedback. 100% positive, Powerseller, Top Ranking Seller, etc. I have sold over $150k worth of Jordan cards in the past year to hundreds of collectors worldwide with ZERO problems. They will all vouch for me and my cards all day long. I also keep records of every purchase and sale. If this were a court case, I would easily overthrow any of Giovanni's accusation with every Proof I have of all the purchases and sales I had for high high amount of money from and to real collectors.


Plain and simple. These guys are blindly accusing me of being shady JUST because I buy/sell very high end 90's Jordan cards for lots of money. I asked them to please provide any PROOF first before calling me any of those false and terrible accusations. But nothing. With ALLLL the talk he does... he has YET to prove anything. If I were indeed shady like he makes me out to be, it would be EASY to find something to end this whole nonsense, but nope... nothing.


So again... he can keep badmouthing me with false accusations based on his OPINIONS and FEELINGS, but as long as I am continuing to do HONEST and AUTHENTIC deals and business like I have been my ENTIRE hobby lifetime, it won't really affect anything and it hasn't.

I mean honestly guys. HONESTLY. How do you not see his true character? This is a guy who has been banned MULTIPLE times on various forums for being super shady. Making fake ID's, imposing as others, shilling, fake selling, etc. The BIGGEST hypocrite the hobby has known. This is the guy that claims Michael Jordan is a nobody. That he is all Hype and that soon people will forget about him. How all his cards will go down in value to nothing. The same guy that JUST because he invested in a few cases of Retros... NOW claims the Retro PMG Red Jordans are $3k dollar cards LEGIT. That the going rate of a PMG Blue Jordan is $20k! That a Retro PMG Green Jordan should be $50k+!! But nooo... not the Original 90's PMG. He thinks those PMG's are ugly and weak. How that and the Gold Embossed Refractor Jordan aren't even worth $500 bucks. But a remade Retro PMG with Jordan in a college uniform, black and white photo with a higher production # is worth thousands! It's pure contradiction.

He is a complete joke and very uneducated. He is so biased and contradicting, it's completely ridiculous.

I'm sorry if my post seems a bit upsetting but you may understand when you have someone like Gio that constantly FALSELY accuses you of being a scammer when your whole life you've been an honest and trustworthy person that has NEVER scammed ANYONE before. It's frustrating, not fair and very very upsetting when you are spending tens of thousands of dollars on these rare Jordans. It's just not right.
 
We all know the NBA was MUCH tougher in the 70s...
It's watered down league, and any title won after 1980 is worth about as much as a DeJuan Blair RC --> NOTHING!
 
Please go and read the entire thing. You will see there is absolutely NO shady practices that I have done EVER. It's the same 3 guys on BO that bad mouth me and the ENTIRE 90's Jordan market.

The first two threads are talking about a card I purchased on eBay with a quick BIN as the $6.4k price tag was cheap for a 97-98 PMG Red Jordan. Guess what, I was scammed and I got my money back from Paypal. I even left that seller a negative feedback to warn others.

http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback2&userid=jansenray&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2776

He has 3 negative feedbacks now with a bunch of scams. I was a VICTIM. So tell me how I did anything shady there.


Now regarding the last thread you posted... it's the same guy Giovanni Azzarelli who has it out for the entire 90's Jordan market. He has bad mouthed me since the very beginning when I posted the $18.25k sale of my 1st Gold Embossed Refractor Jordan BGS 9.5 card Serial #'d 32/74. It was sold to Sir_Lanner, a high end Jordan collector out in the East Coast. I posted proof of sale, Paypal payment receipt, Bank Account transfer, Delivery Confirmation, etc. etc. Still he called it a fake sale and me a scammer. He still does to this day. You should have seen how FURIOUS he was. At first, I didn't understand how anyone could just blatantly call anyone a scammer with no proof, but I later found out by MANY members on various forums that he is delusional and absolutely hates 90's Jordan sellers. That explained alot and if you actually read all of his posts, anyone can see right through this.


Anyways, I was able to get another Gold Embossed Refractor Jordan Serial #'d 54/74 which I sold privately to Nat Turner. Maybe you've heard of him. A millionaire collector that obtains the best of the best. Well the Gold Embossed Refractor was one of the last ones he needed in his collection. He purchased MINE and nybeamo's BGS 9.5 copy at the same time. He explained over at BO that he bought two so he could physically see which one had LESS Fading/Greening, choose the best and sell the extra.

A week or two later after I sold mine to him, I saw it listed on eBay in an open auction. Surprised, I immediately emailed Nat asking if for whatever reason I was to bid and win it at a LOWER price than what I sold it to him... if he'd honor it? He said yes so I started bidding. I already had a set price in mind to bid up so that's exactly what I did. I ended up losing as the buyer ended up winning it for over $15k. BTW, I have saved emails between me and Nat with this same exact conversation that will match the time and date of the whole situation.


So again... NONE, ZERO, ZILCH, absolutely NO shady business have I done with anything. Just look at my feedback. 100% positive, Powerseller, Top Ranking Seller, etc. I have sold over $150k worth of Jordan cards in the past year to hundreds of collectors worldwide with ZERO problems. They will all vouch for me and my cards all day long. I also keep records of every purchase and sale. If this were a court case, I would easily overthrow any of Giovanni's accusation with every Proof I have of all the purchases and sales I had for high high amount of money from and to real collectors.


Plain and simple. These guys are blindly accusing me of being shady JUST because I buy/sell very high end 90's Jordan cards for lots of money. I asked them to please provide any PROOF first before calling me any of those false and terrible accusations. But nothing. With ALLLL the talk he does... he has YET to prove anything. If I were indeed shady like he makes me out to be, it would be EASY to find something to end this whole nonsense, but nope... nothing.


So again... he can keep badmouthing me with false accusations based on his OPINIONS and FEELINGS, but as long as I am continuing to do HONEST and AUTHENTIC deals and business like I have been my ENTIRE hobby lifetime, it won't really affect anything and it hasn't.

Fair enough mate! Good detailed explanation!

I have heard a heap more stuff about you and Natsturner on other forums, but as you said, it is always speculation and even if we wanted to, we wouldn't be able to provide the required proof!

I actually posted to Natsturner about the bit I bolded ^^ and he did confirm this as well. He is renowned for buying multiples of the same card, in order to upgrade as they become available, so it does fit. Also, being a millionaire helps overcome selling a card back at a loss! haha

All I know is that there are PLENTY of shady people in this hobby, all over the world. Your name has been mentioned several times, but the people that make these mentions are usually at a loss to provide anything short of speculation. I will reserve my judgements for when there is ACTUAL PROOF!

I know as well as anyone that Gio is as much of a hypocrite as you can find, especially with the raving about manipulation in the 90's and exquisite market, but then refusing to admit that the Retro stuff is shilled :confused:

So, as far as I am concerned, I welcome your posts here that will help us Aussies spot and stay away from shilled auctions and anything untoward! And, until I get shown proof that you have done anything dodgy, you are alright in my books!:thumbsup:
 
Fair enough mate! Good detailed explanation!

I have heard a heap more stuff about you and Natsturner on other forums, but as you said, it is always speculation and even if we wanted to, we wouldn't be able to provide the required proof!

I actually posted to Natsturner about the bit I bolded ^^ and he did confirm this as well. He is renowned for buying multiples of the same card, in order to upgrade as they become available, so it does fit. Also, being a millionaire helps overcome selling a card back at a loss! haha

All I know is that there are PLENTY of shady people in this hobby, all over the world. Your name has been mentioned several times, but the people that make these mentions are usually at a loss to provide anything short of speculation. I will reserve my judgements for when there is ACTUAL PROOF!

I know as well as anyone that Gio is as much of a hypocrite as you can find, especially with the raving about manipulation in the 90's and exquisite market, but then refusing to admit that the Retro stuff is shilled :confused:

So, as far as I am concerned, I welcome your posts here that will help us Aussies spot and stay away from shilled auctions and anything untoward! And, until I get shown proof that you have done anything dodgy, you are alright in my books!:thumbsup:


Thanks buddy. I appreciate it lots. I have never lied or manipulated anything before. You can believe it or not, but I just have to state the truth. I have a very strong passion and love for this hobby since the early 90's. I completely agree when you say there are plenty of bad people out there that are true scammers, but geez... the things Gio says about me and other 90's collectors is unreal. Again with zero proof. Just purely based on his own opinion and feelings.

And I'm sooo glad you were able to verify what I said with Nat and post yet another proof that helps my case. My cards and history of transactions are an open book. I challenge anyone to go into my eBay profile and see my history and try to find anything shady. You won't cuz there aren't any. It bothered me alot when Gio and his buddies ganged up and kept badmouthing my name everywhere. ESPECIALLY as those accusations were FALSE. But I'm beginning to see everywhere that people are starting to catch onto his craziness. The truth will eventually prevail and it looks like it's slowly revealing itself.
 
Haha yeah back to Retro... I'm almost ashamed to admit it; but I just popped on a case at the current going rate!! :eek: Serves me right for sleeping on the presells!
Is my only chance at salvation busting a 'Hero' PMG or Buyback? There are other inserts are presumably rarer than the red PMG cards (~40-70 print runs) that aren't getting much attention - are the PMGs (MJ, Lebron) the sole reason for the success/hype behind this release???
 
Ok back onto topic. Fleer Retros.

I'm sure you guys have seen the Lebron PMG Green auction that's currently live: http://www.ebay.com/itm/110954184059

The first Lebron PMG Green was sold for $12k BIN, but later the seller confirmed it was purchased by a shill/fake buyer so it was a no deal. Then later he chimed in saying he eventually sold it privately to someone else but definitely under $10k. Then confirmed it was sold for $7k.

Now this Lebron PMG Green is up in auction and up to almost $9k in a single day. Quite odd even with the hype/buzz so a few people did some investigating and this is what they found out.


76 bid retractions between the 7 people bidding on it.

The current high bidder has almost zero bidding activity with only 2 other things. Both of them being batteries. Other than that, this Lebron is the only card.

Second highest bidder is e***i
s.gif
( 253
iconTealStar_25x25.gif
). The same winner that backed out the Lebron 23/50 PMG Blue at $12k BIN and Jordan PMG Blue /50 at $8k BIN.

Then this SAME guy who backed out of that BIN $8k PMG Blue Jordan spends $2k more and wins the shilled PMG Blue Jordan #'d 24/50 for $10k instead:

http://offer.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewBids&_trksid=p2047675.l2565&rt=nc&item=320979668155

You will also see this same ID bidding the hell out of almost every Jordan PMG on eBay. I'm just waiting to see if the seller of the PMG Blue Jordan above will receive a positive feedback from him so the world can see who this person is.

Oh and another interesting thing. This currently LIVE Jordan PMG Blue that was up to almost $9k is now back down to $6100 because the highest bidder retracted saying "he can't pay for the item if he wins." And what perfect time. RIGHT BEFORE the deadline to retract bids. 12 hours before the auction ends. There's definitely a lot of shady stuff going on right now. Be cautious my aussie friends.

http://offer.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewBids&_trksid=p2047675.l2565&rt=nc&item=190726999371

EDIT* - Looks like the above ^ auction was taken down right before the 12 hour mark. Maybe the seller caught on and read what's being said on all the forums?
 
Thanks buddy. I appreciate it lots. I have never lied or manipulated anything before. You can believe it or not, but I just have to state the truth. I have a very strong passion and love for this hobby since the early 90's. I completely agree when you say there are plenty of bad people out there that are true scammers, but geez... the things Gio says about me and other 90's collectors is unreal. Again with zero proof. Just purely based on his own opinion and feelings.

And I'm sooo glad you were able to verify what I said with Nat and post yet another proof that helps my case. My cards and history of transactions are an open book. I challenge anyone to go into my eBay profile and see my history and try to find anything shady. You won't cuz there aren't any. It bothered me alot when Gio and his buddies ganged up and kept badmouthing my name everywhere. ESPECIALLY as those accusations were FALSE. But I'm beginning to see everywhere that people are starting to catch onto his craziness. The truth will eventually prevail and it looks like it's slowly revealing itself.


Dude Just 1 Thing I will ask you again since all your backers blindly turn an eye, Why do you have over 27 bid retractions in 6 mths ???

I mean is that not shady ?

50 other member's could not total 10 combined !

I mean your talking big on your vendetta of retro's here and on HK and Bid retractors when your no better yourself .

Oh yeah we are going to hear some pathetic excuse as to why you do !
 
Dude Just 1 Thing I will ask you again since all your backers blindly turn an eye, Why do you have over 27 bid retractions in 6 mths ???

I mean is that not shady ?

50 other member's could not total 10 combined !


They said to keep it on topic but I must explain this one last thing to clear my name from all these false accusations being constantly made about me and the entire Jordan market. I guess it can still be on topic as we're talking about shillers and bid retractions on these Retro PMG's.

BTW, thanks for asking as I wanted to clear that up. I understand that can seem shady to an outsider at first glance, but truthfully no. Let me explain.

First of all, I consider myself a pretty big participator in the Jordan market. I have bought and sold over $150k worth of Jordan cards in the past year alone. Everything documented btw in real deals. Not trying to brag or boast, but just to give you an idea of how much I bid and purchase cards. If you don't believe me, you can check out my website in my signature. You will see a ton of high end Jordan cards I've dealt.

Now on average, I place around 400 - 500 bids a month on eBay. I had 17 bid retractions in the last 6 months. That's about two and half per month, which is less than 1% of my entire bidding activity. Now imagine this... a 1995-96 Finest Michael Jordan Refractor is listed. Centering is ok and the rest of the card looks good so I place a fair bid. Then the next day when I search, I find a brand new listing by a different seller with the same card but with BETTER centering and the original coating intact. I retract the initial one and bid/win the newer better copy. You must surely comprehend that maybe 2 bid retractions can happen innocently when you're placing ~500 bids every month.


Those same guys that have been badmouthing me have used this retraction theory and falsely accused me of shadiness for a year now. I've even challenged them and anyone else to please go check my history and find every single auction I've participated in where I placed Bid Retractions. You will clearly see that EVERY single bid retraction I had was in the very beginning of the auctions and for very low amounts. Amounts that were far far less than the ending prices. Low bids that could never be considered as a shill bid to drive up any kind of price. And if you check, you will also notice that all of those cards were low to mid-end cards.

So again... those same group of guys that have it out for the entire 90's Jordan market have been using anything to try and steer bad light on me but have failed to bring any substance and facts with their strong claims. I on the other hand have provided a ton of proof to counter their false accusations. It's a mixture of their own personal feelings towards the market and their bitterness towards high end 90's Jordan collectors. They will bite on anything to put them all down. I am no exception.
 
They said to keep it on topic but I must explain this one last thing to clear my name from all these false accusations being constantly made about me and the entire Jordan market. I guess it can still be on topic as we're talking about shillers and bid retractions on these Retro PMG's.

BTW, thanks for asking as I wanted to clear that up. I understand that can seem shady to an outsider at first glance, but truthfully no. Let me explain.

First of all, I consider myself a pretty big participator in the Jordan market. I have bought and sold over $150k worth of Jordan cards in the past year alone. Everything documented btw in real deals. Not trying to brag or boast, but just to give you an idea of how much I bid and purchase cards. If you don't believe me, you can check out my website in my signature. You will see a ton of high end Jordan cards I've dealt.

Now on average, I place around 400 - 500 bids a month on eBay. I had 17 bid retractions in the last 6 months. That's about two and half per month, which is less than 1% of my entire bidding activity. Now imagine this... a 1995-96 Finest Michael Jordan Refractor is listed. Centering is ok and the rest of the card looks good so I place a fair bid. Then the next day when I search, I find a brand new listing by a different seller with the same card but with BETTER centering and the original coating intact. I retract the initial one and bid/win the newer better copy. You must surely comprehend that maybe 2 bid retractions can happen innocently when you're placing ~500 bids every month.


Those same guys that have been badmouthing me have used this retraction theory and falsely accused me of shadiness for a year now. I've even challenged them and anyone else to please go check my history and find every single auction I've participated in where I placed Bid Retractions. You will clearly see that EVERY single bid retraction I had was in the very beginning of the auctions and for very low amounts. Amounts that were far far less than the ending prices. Low bids that could never be considered as a shill bid to drive up any kind of price. And if you check, you will also notice that all of those cards were low to mid-end cards.

So again... those same group of guys that have it out for the entire 90's Jordan market have been using anything to try and steer bad light on me but have failed to bring any substance and facts with their strong claims. I on the other hand have provided a ton of proof to counter their false accusations. It's a mixture of their own personal feelings towards the market and their bitterness towards high end 90's Jordan collectors. They will bite on anything to put them all down. I am no exception.


See maybe an amature that just started collecting and looks at who you collect and the cards you have purchased/sold would believe that but do you realise that I am sure that nobody would even come close to your bid retraction count and I am positive a lot of us bid and probably bid more times that yourself each month .

Your rational of 1% is a meaningless as it as a total adds to 27 you had in the last 6 mths .

Does anyone on this site even have a remotely close retraction amount as Rare Air ?

A survey on BO showed out of 50+ members that have been long time collectors and the most someone had was 4 in 6mths .

How can you justify 27 , as much as i want to buy into your excuse it just doesn't fit regardless you sold a 1 million dollar card .

If you are saying 7 bidders had a total of 76 that is an average of around 10 bid retractions if they had your bid retraction total of 27 they combined would have over 160+.

It seems funny you that has 27 in 6mths calling out cards you are not invested being shilled by guys that average 9 retractions in 6mths and you alone equal 3 of these guy's on your own!
 
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