PSA Grading - going off track to the one earlier so started a new one

[hackadeandre]

I'm glad I saw the previous thread as this is basically the only thing I don't understand about cards. I'm going off track from the original post so I decided to started another one because for the life of me I cannot understand why PSA 10's sell for a great deal more than BGS 9.5's (other than the obvious that one 'says' a 10 and the other says a 9.5 but both described as 'gem mint'). I have done comparisons before on some of the cards that I have, and when I read this I thought I'll have a look at one of the most obvious comparisons I could make that would have a huge number of examples to make a comparison. And surprise surprise it backs up how I already feel about it.

Doncic Prizm RC:
PSA gem mint = 8580 cards
PSA total graded = 11555 cards
% of gem mint PSA to total graded = 74.25%

BGS gem mint (or above) = 1677 cards
BGS total graded = 2923 cards
% of gem mint BGS to total graded = 57.37%

So 74.25% of Doncic Prizm RC's sent to PSA get gem mint and only 57.37% sent to BGS get gem mint however PSA gem mint is worth more. I have seen it the other way (with a much lesser margin) however there are more gem mint PSA's than gem mint BGS's (in my opinion that I've looked at) in most circumstances. Even the cards I have purchased as a PSA (that I always send to BGS to regrade) have come back from BGS with a lesser grade except for literally one occasion where I got a BGS 9.5 with a PSA 9.

If anyone can help me understand this phenomenon I would greatly appreciate it

 

[Billyhoyle]

it also shows the crazy number of prizm printed (taking into account some of them may have been resubbed - but for every resub is a card that hasn't been graded) -almost 15,000 graded!

 

[hackadeandre]

it also shows the crazy number of prizm printed (taking into account some of them may have been resubbed - but for every resub is a card that hasn't been graded) -almost 15,000 graded!

Yeah there are crazy amounts of this stuff. However I do understand that it’s supply and demand and cards are really popular again, so I get the prices. But going on this supply and demand argument how are PSA gem mints worth more than BGS gem mints when the population % of gem mint to total cards graded is (generally) lower for BGS?

 

[Billyhoyle]

Yeah there are crazy amounts of this stuff. However I do understand that it’s supply and demand and cards are really popular again, so I get the prices. But going on this supply and demand argument how are PSA gem mints worth more than BGS gem mints when the population % of gem mint to total cards graded is (generally) lower for BGS?

yeah spot on I think that people forget that BGS9.5 = PSA10 and there is a mentality associated with the PSA10 being better

 

[hackadeandre]

yeah spot on I think that people forget that BGS9.5 = PSA10 and there is a mentality associated with the PSA10 being better

Yep that is the only thing I can come up with as well. It seems insane to me. I would never ever pay a premium for a PSA 10.

 

[anakinleo]

Short answer is the supply and demand of the respective graded cards (psa vs bgs). BECKETT even thou has the more advance grading system with the sub grades and pristine 10 grading, inadvertently “pushes” all the premium to the highest grade of each card which happens to be a pristine 10 for some prizm card. The demand for Bgs9.5 then falls off pretty dramatically.

The demand of PSA cards are very different. They truely have a much larger collector base and their grading system is perceived to be much more homogeneous or standardised.

 

[1stBowman]

I'm glad I saw the previous thread as this is basically the only thing I don't understand about cards. I'm going off track from the original post so I decided to started another one because for the life of me I cannot understand why PSA 10's sell for a great deal more than BGS 9.5's (other than the obvious that one 'says' a 10 and the other says a 9.5 but both described as 'gem mint'). I have done comparisons before on some of the cards that I have, and when I read this I thought I'll have a look at one of the most obvious comparisons I could make that would have a huge number of examples to make a comparison. And surprise surprise it backs up how I already feel about it.

Doncic Prizm RC:
PSA gem mint = 8580 cards
PSA total graded = 11555 cards
% of gem mint PSA to total graded = 74.25%

BGS gem mint (or above) = 1677 cards
BGS total graded = 2923 cards
% of gem mint BGS to total graded = 57.37%

So 74.25% of Doncic Prizm RC's sent to PSA get gem mint and only 57.37% sent to BGS get gem mint however PSA gem mint is worth more. I have seen it the other way (with a much lesser margin) however there are more gem mint PSA's than gem mint BGS's (in my opinion that I've looked at) in most circumstances. Even the cards I have purchased as a PSA (that I always send to BGS to regrade) have come back from BGS with a lesser grade except for literally one occasion where I got a BGS 9.5 with a PSA 9.

If anyone can help me understand this phenomenon I would greatly appreciate it

Grading novice here, but doesn't PSA goes much easier on centering? meaning it's far more likely to get a higher grade with PSA than BGS given that the majority of cards have average/poor centering.

 

[warriors_man]

Because the way BGS grading works is that you can get a 9.5 "gem mint" with 1x 9 sub grade, as long as all the other sub grades are 9.5 or above, so there are 9.5s with 9 corners or edges that would never grade gem mint (PSA10) with PSA. So BGS9.5 isn't equal to PSA10

 

[1stBowman]

Because the way BGS grading works is that you can get a 9.5 "gem mint" with 1x 9 sub grade, as long as all the other sub grades are 9.5 or above, so there are 9.5s with 9 corners or edges that would never grade gem mint (PSA10) with PSA. So BGS9.5 isn't equal to PSA10

Again, even as a grading novice, from all I've read and heard the BGS 9.5 is not only not equal with a PSA 10, it's not close to a PSA10

Excellent point with regards to corners ( surely way more important than centering). One could argue that a BGS 9.5 with 9 sub grade corners is the equivalent of a PSA 9 - never mind a PSA 10.

 

[Tanana]

PSA also have a huge following with the set registry,

Also with BGS, it’s never ending unless you get a black label BGS 10, with PSA it’s just a Gem Mint grade. To the naked eye, not many will notice the difference between a 9 & 10, let alone a BGS 9.5 and BGS 10.

 

[hackadeandre]

Grading novice here, but doesn't PSA goes much easier on centering? meaning it's far more likely to get a higher grade with PSA than BGS given that the majority of cards have average/poor centering.

Yes each company has different idiosyncrasies with respect to the grading such as you pointed out. So my question is exactly what you did point out; meaning there is obviously a better chance of getting a PSA gem mint than a BGS gem mint based on the percentages with each respective company of gem mints / total cards graded, so I'm just wondering why the easier way to gain a gem mint is the one that commands the higher price.

Because the way BGS grading works is that you can get a 9.5 "gem mint" with 1x 9 sub grade, as long as all the other sub grades are 9.5 or above, so there are 9.5s with 9 corners or edges that would never grade gem mint (PSA10) with PSA. So BGS9.5 isn't equal to PSA10

This card is one of the examples I was talking about, was originally a PSA 10. It has 8.5 and 9 subgrades and this is my experience in all regrades except for 1 occasion out of at least 15 (probably 20) regrades.

Again, even as a grading novice, from all I've read and heard the BGS 9.5 is not only not equal with a PSA 10, it's not close to a PSA10

PSA is way more popular right now so it's a lot like the news with hidden agendas from the various publications, don't believe everything you hear. Purely based on pop reports of each company it's simply not true that a PSA 10 is a premium quality card over a BGS 9.5.

Excellent point with regards to corners ( surely way more important than centering).

Not in the case of vintage. Cards with better centering of the same grade command a higher price. This is something I do know as I've bought every important RC since 1948 Bowman and watched many many auctions over the years.

PSA also have a huge following with the set registry,

Also with BGS, it’s never ending unless you get a black label BGS 10, with PSA it’s just a Gem Mint grade. To the naked eye, not many will notice the difference between a 9 & 10, let alone a BGS 9.5 and BGS 10.

Yes I agree the set registry could be a part of it. Do people do much with the set registry on non-vintage stuff? I know it's big in vintage. Also agreed that the difference is negligible between the high grades of both especially once they are encased!