It's the hall of fame, I think it needs to be really hard to get in, I'm not completely convinced that iverson, carter or t-mac should make it, they were good players who never really achieved much on a team level. As individuals they were very solid, I would of absolutely said yes right now if they took Philly, Toronto or magic to a championship. Are individual achievements enough? Most players would tell you they would rather win a championship then an MVP or DPOY, so that speaks volumes when considering HOF.
Fringe Hall of Fame Players
- Thread starter GarnettFan4Life
- Start date
I think Billups will get in eventually on the back of his Finals MVP - it will take 5 - 10 years though.
Ben and Rasheed Wallace are both borderline. I think Ben will almost certainly thanks to his 4xDPOY - but that really opens up the debate for Sheed and Chris Webber as they were vastly better players at their peak.
Ben and Rasheed Wallace are both borderline. I think Ben will almost certainly thanks to his 4xDPOY - but that really opens up the debate for Sheed and Chris Webber as they were vastly better players at their peak.
Mark Aguirre could well be considered. 2x NBA champ with the Bad Boy Pistons, 3x All Star, 18458 career points, career averages of 20PPG, 5RPG & 3.1APG, Naismith College Player of the Year 1980 and still holds the all time points record at Depaul in front of the likes of George Mikan.
GarnettFan4Life
OZCT Supporter
Interesting table that uses a formula to try and predict who will get in
http://www.basketball-reference.com/leaders/hof_prob.html
Vince Carter 77%
TMac 58%
http://www.basketball-reference.com/leaders/hof_prob.html
Vince Carter 77%
TMac 58%
GarnettFan4Life
OZCT Supporter
Interesting percentages:
Mark Aguirre mentioned above - 42%
Players already in HOF
Chris Mullin - 13%
Ralph Sampson - 2%
Reggie Miller - 7%
Summary
Hall of Fame probabilities are presented for all players with a minimum of 400 NBA games played. Although it can be risky to make predictions for active players, you can think of these probabilities as answering the question "If this player retired today, what is the probability he would be elected to the Hall of Fame?". The model was built using a pool of 750 players. One method to assess classification accuracy is to compare the estimated Hall of Fame probability for the case to the actual result. Of the 750 players, 89 had been elected to the Hall of Fame and 661 had not. If the player's predicted probability of election was greater than or equal to 0.5, I predicted that he was in the Hall of Fame. Of the 89 players in the Hall of Fame, 74 were correctly classified (83.1%) and 15 were not (16.9%). Of the 661 players not in the Hall of Fame, 651 were correctly classified (98.5%) and 10 were not (1.5%). Overall, 725 of the 750 players (96.7%) were correctly classified by the model.
Mark Aguirre mentioned above - 42%
Players already in HOF
Chris Mullin - 13%
Ralph Sampson - 2%
Reggie Miller - 7%
Summary
Hall of Fame probabilities are presented for all players with a minimum of 400 NBA games played. Although it can be risky to make predictions for active players, you can think of these probabilities as answering the question "If this player retired today, what is the probability he would be elected to the Hall of Fame?". The model was built using a pool of 750 players. One method to assess classification accuracy is to compare the estimated Hall of Fame probability for the case to the actual result. Of the 750 players, 89 had been elected to the Hall of Fame and 661 had not. If the player's predicted probability of election was greater than or equal to 0.5, I predicted that he was in the Hall of Fame. Of the 89 players in the Hall of Fame, 74 were correctly classified (83.1%) and 15 were not (16.9%). Of the 661 players not in the Hall of Fame, 651 were correctly classified (98.5%) and 10 were not (1.5%). Overall, 725 of the 750 players (96.7%) were correctly classified by the model.
I'm sorry but Iverson and Vince Carter are sure things for the HOF.
Are individual achievements enough? Of course they are, otherwise you would have guys like Malone and Stockton out of the HOF for never winning a ring.
As much as winning a championship is important, it does not make you necessarily HOF worthy.
Iverson is a 1st ballot IMO.
Vince probably not, but he had a nice 3 years in College, plus he WAS the NBA in 2000 when he was keeping people entertained with his freakish dunks + he played for team USA and did THAT dunk at the Olympics.
They both kept fans interested in the NBA.
I could take or leave T-Mac though.
I think it's getting harder and harder though, as there will be many more players lining up that are HOF worthy.
Billups I'd like to see get in, but he may not. Ben Wallace I think should some day. I don't think Rasheed is HOF worthy even though I loved his game.
But then maybe the entire 04 Pistons will make it in together for a massive upset?
I think it does need to be more exclusive, it should be the best of the best.
Well to answer your question here are the things the statisical anyalsis mentioned above used to determined probability
http://www.basketball-reference.com/about/hof_prob.html
- height (in inches)
- last season indicator (1 if 1959-60 or before, 0 otherwise)
- NBA points per game
- NBA rebounds per game
- NBA assists per game
- NBA All-Star game selections
- NBA championships won
GarnettFan4Life
OZCT Supporter
yeah I seen that I meant the judges/board of selectors. I bet they each have their own criteria that differs slightly from the next
SharpysSports
OzCardTrader
I didn't know how much of a gun he is until I picked him up in my fantasy team this year.
Is he HOF worthy? Yes I would say so. Getting a ring will help his cause no end.
How bout someone like Horace Grant? He helped the Jordan era Bulls to those rings...
GarnettFan4Life
OZCT Supporter
1% chance for Z-Bo....surprising
15% chance according to the stats for Horace
1 time All-Star
Career Averages 11pts 8reb 2ast
http://www.basketball-reference.com/leaders/hof_prob.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/g/grantho01.html
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GarnettFan4Life
OZCT Supporter
Interesting I just found this too, browsing the Grantland vids
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HkVxSezwdAQ
GarnettFan4Life
OZCT Supporter
I'd say no for Kevin Johnson - I think because there is no clear definition for entry requirements, and I know it's almost impossible because some qualities are not statistically quantifiable - but the whole Hall of Fame is in danger of losing respectability.