Dear Panini - 2018 update

My original thread was going to be a rant about Vanguard and Opulence. I thought the better of it and instead remembered an old thread @Matt26 started when Panini took over and were in pre-production. The amount of feedback and input was incredible, and I'm not sure if any other sites chipped in but looking at the releases now you can see that A LOT of the good requests and pointers was taken into consideration.

It's a long read but have a look through this link below if you haven't seen it yet or are a newer member here. And after that, let's get some constructive feedback and more suggestions going this year for them as I think they are a bit off track. 50 releases this season or some crazy number? Let's do this.


Original panini thread here:

https://www.ozcardtrader.com.au/threads/exciting-panini-news-your-feedback-please.43828/

notable points suggested in 2009 -

Incorporated:

- Past & Present autograph cards - ie Glen Rice/Daequan Cook from the Miami Heat or Mitch Richmond/Kevin Martin of the Kings (just as examples). I know some sets already have some like these but more would be great.

- a greater variety of old and retired players? I understand it's hard to get them to sign cards, but it's always cool when you incorporate stars from the past into autograph sets, for me particularly the 90's, cards of GP, Mullin, Richmond, Kemp etc are all pretty cool.

- Date stamped GU cards (if possible). I love the finals GU card because you know when they were (supposedly) worn. SOMETIMES - seems like really too RARE though!

- One more thing I forgot to add, was I think I speak for most people on this site when I say we feel the same way about manufactured patches as we do with sticker autos. They should be a big no no.

- On card AUTOS!

- BETTER INSERT CARDS, like the Jambalaya (GU cards are getting boring)

- printing plates

- Memorabilia – Redemption cards for complete game used jersey, shoes, autographed photo etc would be great to be randomly insert into products.

-Bigger swatch/jersey size, i think its pointless to have this tiny little area of a tiny piece of "game worn material" when you could use us the whole bottom third and make it so much better looking.

- I like the look of Draft Day stuff, do something cool with the draft day worn hat, suit, team logo, lottery balls, pics from the draft day, table name cards etc



Ignored:

- Please do not do redemptions, particularly if they will not be made.

- Tight quality control - no typos, correct patch for the card, autoed stickers on the right way, no dinged cards straight out of packs!

- parallels are another big issue. Topps were the big culprits of this.... we do not need 17 different parallels of the one card; plus if you're going to produce a parallel of a card at least make it look different..... not just different numbering & different color text or something simple like that is pretty poor as well.

- Less sticker autos!

- Fraud protected – Something should be done to keep people from faking patches. A simple plastic coating over the patch would cut down a lot on fakes as it would force the fakers to split the card, a much harder process. (07-08 Rookie Threads rookie auto jerseys are a good example of what I’m talking about) i.e. a database/scan of higher end cards before they go out so buyers on ebay can compare to one that might be listed and tell if it's been altered

- Redemptions for the set of the printing plates instead of finding 4 different colours in 4 different releases

-Release 15 to 20 brands/sub brands of products, not 40 (like UD did)

- No scrub/semi-star players in SUPER high end boxes - sorry but BJ Armstrong should not be in Opulence.....PLENTY of HOFers and legends SURELY you can have in that kind of product!

New suggestions/feedback main pointers:


Patch registry - reduce chances cards can be altered and sold at a premium

Quality control/education at the athlete autograph stage - reduces chances cards are damaged before even going into the product

Revised redemption process re exchanges (???)

Review of how redemptions are placed in earlier products but on card autos in later year products leaving the early buyers in the lurch

I agree with everything above.. Too many releases, too many sticker autos, too many parrells, too many scrubs from the 80's in high end product.

My biggest beef is with sticker autos. Totally certified is low endish but manages to bang out oncard autos no problem at all.

And I think @nissangtr35 could elaborate more on the sheer amount of cards the rookies had to sign in 17-18. No wonder Franks jumper was broken last season when he had to do 1000 autos a day.

Something similar to what Leaf did with Ichiro and the game used stuff.. Took a photo of all 50 cards and showed you exactly that patches were on what card.. Couldn't be faked then

My main input now would be to do with quality control. And not just at the product packing stage but at the athlete signing stage. There has to be some accountability for quality and education at the signing session where the athlete might not care about these cards and just signs 2000 of them and they're strewn all over a table but they have to know that condition matters and these have to go in packs and boxes and will be treasured by fans and collectors all over the world.
We've seen many photos and instagram stories of guys just chucking stuff down onto tables after signing and to think that might be a product hit in a $2000 a case or box product is horrific QC.

of all the complaining and panini bashing that goes on, i'm SHOCKED at the lack of response to this! How much money gets spent on singles, boxes, cases and group breaks and people don't have anything constructive to say, KNOWING that this will be read by the Panini team in some form??? Lame.

GarnettFan4Life said:

of all the complaining and panini bashing that goes on, i'm SHOCKED at the lack of response to this! How much money gets spent on singles, boxes, cases and group breaks and people don't have anything constructive to say, KNOWING that this will be read by the Panini team in some form??? Lame.

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Agreed, I don't bust or join breaks these days, I just stick to singles and I'm very strict about what releases I buy (and I just ignore the rest) so no complaints from me, but it is noticeable that a few members who always bust boxes and complain about Panini are silent in this thread

Panini wouldnt care what we in Australia think mate from the Asian countries and US maybe

wasportsfan1 said:

Panini would care what we in Australia think mate from the Asian countries and US maybe

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Disagree mate! If they read it, it gets IN THE BRAINNNNNNN - subconscious lol
Someone wakes in a sweat **PATCH REGISTRY!** they blurt out

I agree with most of the main points covered so far.

Just want to add my thoughts in regards to redemptions:

- Overall I think there are improvements. The fact they still accept expired redemptions does help maintain interest in older releases, and removes the anxiety of pulling a nice redemption and not being able to redeem it.

- The do try to accommodate the collector during the replacement process. However, I feel it's a bit of a lottery. I've read success stories where people were able to replace complete scrubs in exchange for superstars. And I've also read stories where people were forced to trade multiple redemptions for one card at book value. So if their policy is to make the customer happy by allowing very favorable trades, then they really need to implement it for everyone.

- There should be minimal wait time between from when a player returns a card, to Panini shipping it to the customer. Really not much point announcing what cards have been returned in the weekly redemption update, if they are not going to ship the card out within a reasonable time frame!

i.e. I'm still waiting on a card that was confirmed returned on September 21st (I redeemed the card back in May), and they are unable to provide me with an update when it will be shipped out.

-

jkidd05 said:

I agree with most of the main points covered so far.

Just want to add my thoughts in regards to redemptions:

- Overall I think there are improvements. The fact they still accept expired redemptions does help maintain interest in older releases, and removes the anxiety of pulling a nice redemption and not being able to redeem it.

- The do try to accommodate the collector during the replacement process. However, I feel it's a bit of a lottery. I've read success stories where people were able to replace complete scrubs in exchange for superstars. And I've also read stories where people were forced to trade multiple redemptions for one card at book value. So if their policy is to make the customer happy by allowing very favorable trades, then they really need to implement it for everyone.

- There should be minimal wait time between from when a player returns a card, to Panini shipping it to the customer. Really not much point announcing what cards have been returned in the weekly redemption update, if they are not going to ship the card out within a reasonable time frame!

i.e. I'm still waiting on a card that was confirmed returned on September 21st (I redeemed the card back in May), and they are unable to provide me with an update when it will be shipped out.

-

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I don't know how they can fix the issue that I have, what does everyone suggest:


I hit a Reggie Miller from National Treasures - redemption

Reggie signs cards in between the production of these redemptions and the release of the next products (Spectra, Impeccable, Opulence), so the people who get the later products are getting nice on card autos and the people who bought first after the announcement of Reggie being in the product are forced to wait until the next time he signs (currently exceeded 5 months since redeeming).

Their excuse for that is, they can't control what cards the players sign and return. A real cop out response in my opinion. The fact they insert redemptions in a product means they have a responsibility as a company to give what customers paid good money for. A redemption is just some random letters on a cardboard until it is filled.

I love buying boxes but I’m starting to drift away as $150 for a Box with 1 Auto and you get a 2nd Round Draft Pick (didn’t intend to start a TJ Leaf Pc!) and the lowest #d is /60#.

Maybe they could look at quality control and guarantee a minimum number of Points per box based on allocating points to types of cards.

Auto of 1 x All Star = 10 points
Auto of Top 15 Pick Rookie = 20 points
Auto of 3 x All Star = 20 points
Auto of 1 x MVP or HOF = 30 points
Parallel /10 = 10 points
Parallel /5 = 20 points
1/1 = 50 points

And each box guarantees a minimum 50 points or similar. So you might get 2 or 3 Autos of low end players, or 1 Auto of an All Star and /5.

I haven’t spent any time on the points allocation so don’t analyse that, just the concept that if I pay for a good I should be guaranteed some level of value, and saying you get 1 Auto doesn’t meet that criteria. You still have a risk that the 2xChamp Javale McGee is allocated a few too many points, but no system will be perfect.

jkidd05 said:

Their excuse for that is, they can't control what cards the players sign and return. A real cop out response in my opinion. The fact they insert redemptions in a product means they have a responsibility as a company to give what customers paid good money for. A redemption is just some random letters on a cardboard until it is filled.

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Yeah it’s tough. Maybe they should make all that years releases for that player redemptions then, then send out all out once? Not fair to initial release buyers when later ones are getting autos and the market is flooding in the mean time you’re sitting there waiting for a year or something

I'd like to see them get rid of points altogether,
have less to no stickers in products they just saturate the market, and bring back the amount of products released for 1 season. 20 is plenty 30 is just way too much, it has made me lose interest in collecting to be honest because there is just too much to chase. Surely they can get more creative with chase cards and inserts rather than just releasing another set that is forgotten about within a week. Redemptions for full game worn jerseys, shorts, shoes or rare artwork like the original 09/10 court kings with le cinque piu belles would be amazing.
And mem cards including auto versions should be game worn otherwise what's the point? Its just a bit of cardboard with a hole in it containing a piece of cloth with no meaning at all behind it. They're not even worth the paper they are printed on.

I thought Playoff Contenders was possibly the best product of the year, every case was pure fire, i thought it was a really well put together set with the throwback rookies of today's stars and on card autos on a very simple but nice design.

You are a good egg GarnettFan4Life. Kudos for trying, though I doubt Panini or any of the others will be doing any listening, much less acting- on, what are very valid suggestions.

Sticker autos are junk - full stop. They are cheap and they are nasty. To see them in any products is depressing - let alone high end ones.

And the amount of releases is truly mind boggling. Immaculate, Impeccable...imfuckenwhatever.

Topps is little better: Topps Chrome followed by Topps Chrome Sapphire Edition. That, plus 40 other baseball releases so far this year with more to come.

I have had a Bowman Chrome Prospect Auto Robert Luis redemption sitting with Topps for 5 months now. I'll be 'happy' if I get my card before 12 months is up.

Redemptions are a joke. They shouldn't exist.

I recently watched a 4 box case break of a high end product. Each box had a redemption in it. The breaker saying the word 'congrats' just didn't seem right. Congrats on your card which may take a year or more to receive, or worse....an IOU.

No sticker autos, no redemptions and half the releases.

Keep up the good work.

1stBowman said:

You are a good egg GarnettFan4Life. Kudos for trying, though I doubt Panini or any of the others will be doing any listening, much less acting- on, what are very valid suggestions.

Sticker autos are junk - full stop. They are cheap and they are nasty. To see them in any products is depressing - let alone high end ones.

And the amount of releases is truly mind boggling. Immaculate, Impeccable...imf***enwhatever.

Topps is little better: Topps Chrome followed by Topps Chrome Sapphire Edition. That, plus 40 other baseball releases so far this year with more to come.

I have had a Bowman Chrome Prospect Auto Robert Luis redemption sitting with Topps for 5 months now. I'll be 'happy' if I get my card before 12 months is up.

Redemptions are a joke. They shouldn't exist.

I recently watched a 4 box case break of a high end product. Each box had a redemption in it. The breaker saying the word 'congrats' just didn't seem right. Congrats on your card which may take a year or more to receive, or worse....an IOU.

No sticker autos, no redemptions and half the releases.

Keep up the good work.

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Thanks @1stBowman ! Appreciate the feedback and welcome!

No worries.

Also, just to clarify, it looks like I was suffering a little dyslexia during my post. That redemption is of Luis Robert. The former North Queensland 5/8 Robert Lui may have been responsible for the mix-up.

Autographs
I like the idea of every auto being on card. PG hasn't had an on card autograph released for a while which as a collector doesn't bother me. I would prefer to collect fewer on card autos than a never ending supply of sticker autos.

Redemptions
I can't stand redemptions. If Panini can't guarantee that a player will return the card in time for packing I would suggest they don't include the player in the set.

Patches
I'm not sure how they cut up their jerseys however lower number patches need to have a much nicer patch than the higher numbered versions. 1/1's need to be on a another level.

I'm sure I'll have more to add...