#001 League Sensations & Young Guns (Framed Jersey Image on Page 13)

edygriff21 said:
I hope they make 1/1's next year, and then I might buy some again, so I can gouge people like ESP does.
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I really, honestly hope they do 1/1s - not so much the jersey, but something special - they have pretty much stated they "learnt" from that mistake and wont do it again, but the idea of a white whale/holy grail being out there to be collected and busted is sort the ultimate reason that I enjoy this hobby, I mean the storm one has been basically confirmed as being pulled, but I have yet to see a pic, so I still hold out hope that I may come across it, however the jersey is really what turns me off tho, so I wouldn't buy it if I did come across it and potentially would even sell if off if I busted it, because thats not MY dream card/item. Everyone has their own card and or cards or sets or whatever that they would love to own, but blaming ESP for trying something different doesn't improve the hobby for anyone.
 
stormernumber1 said:
I really, honestly hope they do 1/1s - not so much the jersey, but something special - they have pretty much stated they "learnt" from that mistake and wont do it again, but the idea of a white whale/holy grail being out there to be collected and busted is sort the ultimate reason that I enjoy this hobby, I mean the storm one has been basically confirmed as being pulled, but I have yet to see a pic, so I still hold out hope that I may come across it, however the jersey is really what turns me off tho, so I wouldn't buy it if I did come across it and potentially would even sell if off if I busted it, because thats not MY dream card/item. Everyone has their own card and or cards or sets or whatever that they would love to own, but blaming ESP for trying something different doesn't improve the hobby for anyone.
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Mate, I've got no dramas with 1/1's. I love the chase of short printed cards, unlike most of these nrl team collectors. I hate ESP for their gouging and non-transparent trading practices, and the fact that their releases have gone so far backwards from their original release.
 
1/1's I don't think are appropriate. I personally believe 1/1's will kill the hobby. Due to the size of the sets there are very few master set collectors left with most people these days turning to Team Set collections so by putting out a 1/1 it means only 1 person can ever have a true complete team set collection so ultimately those who can't get the 1/1's will be driven away completely.

While I didn't agree with the jersey (as I'm not a memorabilia collector) if they want to give away a special prize such as a jersey for/with the 001 card that is fine but they need to have redemption cards for all the cards and it just the person with the 001 redemption that gets the prize.
 
Well I think it's the team collectors that are killing the nrl trading card hobby. No matter what garbage ESP dishes out, they continue to support them, with this whole "my collection needs to be complete" bs!! Instead of pressuring them into supplying quality products by closing their wallets, they continue to chase every boring fucking parallel, and paying twice as much per pack as other sports.
 
edygriff21 said:
Well I think it's the team collectors that are killing the nrl trading card hobby. No matter what garbage ESP dishes out, they continue to support them, with this whole "my collection needs to be complete" bs!! Instead of pressuring them into supplying quality products by closing their wallets, they continue to chase every boring f***ing parallel, and paying twice as much per pack as other sports.
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I have no issue with 1/1's and do not feel as if my collection is compromised by them or more accurately by not having them. As a St George team collector I have long ago come to the realisation that my collection will never be 100% complete without winning Power ball due to the sheer number of high end cards available. I still enjoy the chase of adding to my collection what I can when I can.

The suggestion that as a team collector I am killing the NRL card trading hobby would have to be one of the most ridiculous comments I have heard for some time. Seriously first of all ask how did I and most of the other collectors end up as team collectors? Well when set collecting went from attainable on my budget to me requiring to sell my kidneys to fund a set I decided that to keep my interest in the hobby without leaving it all together I will collect what I get the most enjoyment out of my team. This "team collecting" is not a new phenomenon I believe team collectors are also prevalent in most sports card collecting even just simply player collecting in NBA.

I think your following comments about cost and product is the real reason the NRL trading card hobby is suffering and this has nothing to do with the collectors but sits wholly with the suppliers. Vote with our wallets well I think you will find that this is occurring as I know a lot of us now are resigned to purchasing our wants through the secondary markets rather than buying the cases / boxes we used too and that there remains a lot of unsold product in many of the recent ESP releases.

Ross
 
hobo said:
I have no issue with 1/1's and do not feel as if my collection is compromised by them or more accurately by not having them. As a St George team collector I have long ago come to the realisation that my collection will never be 100% complete without winning Power ball due to the sheer number of high end cards available. I still enjoy the chase of adding to my collection what I can when I can.

The suggestion that as a team collector I am killing the NRL card trading hobby would have to be one of the most ridiculous comments I have heard for some time. Seriously first of all ask how did I and most of the other collectors end up as team collectors? Well when set collecting went from attainable on my budget to me requiring to sell my kidneys to fund a set I decided that to keep my interest in the hobby without leaving it all together I will collect what I get the most enjoyment out of my team. This "team collecting" is not a new phenomenon I believe team collectors are also prevalent in most sports card collecting even just simply player collecting in NBA.

I think your following comments about cost and product is the real reason the NRL trading card hobby is suffering and this has nothing to do with the collectors but sits wholly with the suppliers. Vote with our wallets well I think you will find that this is occurring as I know a lot of us now are resigned to purchasing our wants through the secondary markets rather than buying the cases / boxes we used too and that there remains a lot of unsold product in many of the recent ESP releases.

Ross
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I think you may be one of the few team collectors that has no problem with 1/1's, but most of the others do not want them. A lot of collectors want this chance at hitting rare cards, but there is so much resistance and whingeing from these hard core collectors, that it's affecting the rest of us.

I honestly don't think you guys are voting with your wallet, but you've just changed the way you purchase the cards. Look how many case/team breaks there are now. I think Diggaz is nearly upto break 30. I don't want to see Michaels business hurt, I would just rather people be buying more cases/boxes directly from him, and then trading. That's the fun part about the hobby. This won't happen because ESP product is still moving, even with these ridiculous prices they are asking for boxes and cases. The content quality has dropped, but prices have increased, but since the cards are out there, team collectors "must" have them. Nothing will change till you guys boycott their shit. They get rid of the best set in the product (league sensations), yet the price dramatically increases, but still you buy it.

I love breaking cases, and use to love trading to help the team/master set collectors out, but their refusal to do anything over the last garbage release, leaves a sour taste in my mouth. They all complain about how many bullshit parallels there are, yet you see them buying/trading for these same cards on another page.
 
I'm a team collector, always have been always will be - and I know more than a few that are exactly the same. Why would I collect other teams I have no interest in?
All in all, I've been happy with ESP's product. Some of it is better than others - there is a broad range of stuff for different people to collect. The multiple sets of parallels and 1/1 fiasco - is a small gripe by a few collectors on fairly expansive releases so far. As for a kudeta, I'm pretty happy that I actually have something to collect. It could be worse, there could be nothing, and the product could be worse. It's retarded to think that no body buying the product will force the company to change the design - they'll simply stop making them all together. ESP were around before they started making cards...
 
edygriff21 said:
I think you may be one of the few team collectors that has no problem with 1/1's, but most of the others do not want them. A lot of collectors want this chance at hitting rare cards, but there is so much resistance and whingeing from these hard core collectors, that it's affecting the rest of us.

I honestly don't think you guys are voting with your wallet, but you've just changed the way you purchase the cards. Look how many case/team breaks there are now. I think Diggaz is nearly upto break 30. I don't want to see Michaels business hurt, I would just rather people be buying more cases/boxes directly from him, and then trading. That's the fun part about the hobby. This won't happen because ESP product is still moving, even with these ridiculous prices they are asking for boxes and cases. The content quality has dropped, but prices have increased, but since the cards are out there, team collectors "must" have them. Nothing will change till you guys boycott their s***. They get rid of the best set in the product (league sensations), yet the price dramatically increases, but still you buy it.

I love breaking cases, and use to love trading to help the team/master set collectors out, but their refusal to do anything over the last garbage release, leaves a sour taste in my mouth. They all complain about how many bulls*** parallels there are, yet you see them buying/trading for these same cards on another page.
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The 1/1 argument I can sort of follow but the reality is the card in question is a simple redemption card, the card it redeemed was in fact 1/130 so personally I can't see the attraction with the redemption card being worth $1000 and the redeemed card $200.... that's crazy mixed up sh^t.

We agree on many points, the rubbish in both price and quality we are being dished up is the root cause of the problem and this comes directly from the arrogance of the manufacturer.

In regards to voting with our wallets; this is a hard one, because ESP do not sell direct to us, they sell to the same traders who's businesses you / we don't want to hurt and I think Michael's move to box / team breaks is a reflection of this move in collecting habits, other traders I know are starting to buy less and less each release in fear of being stuck with excess stock. I would imagine many of us here still source a lot of the cards we want from the dealers here on OCT and are happy to pay the small "release" premiums to keep them active / afloat rather than wait for the death of the release and the fire sales on Ebay.

Cheers
Ross

P.S. Can't wait for the next release......the off season is a killer.
 
batboy said:
I'm a team collector, always have been always will be - and I know more than a few that are exactly the same. Why would I collect other teams I have no interest in?
All in all, I've been happy with ESP's product. Some of it is better than others - there is a broad range of stuff for different people to collect. The multiple sets of parallels and 1/1 fiasco - is a small gripe by a few collectors on fairly expansive releases so far. As for a kudeta, I'm pretty happy that I actually have something to collect. It could be worse, there could be nothing, and the product could be worse. It's retarded to think that no body buying the product will force the company to change the design - they'll simply stop making them all together. ESP were around before they started making cards...
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So you think buying whatever crap they dish out, and letting them increase prices every year, without increasing the quality is ok. Ffs, they took out half the autos, but increased the price by what, $4 a pack. That's just bullshit, and still you guys took the reaming they gave you. There's no transparency with this company. They refuse to show previews or checklists to collectors, yet you still support them. I'd rather have nothing than give these pricks any money. The unfortunate part about that, is that it would hurt the dealers, whom I I'd love to support. I hope they give up their licence, and let someone else take it on, because it's just been downhill so quickly after a promising 2013 release.

I'm a team/player collector myself, and have nothing against people doing that. That's what this hobby is about, collecting what you want. But it seems nrl team collectors are so much more hardcore/anal about having to have every card from every release, so there's no chance they will stop collecting. ESP knows this, so they build bigger, cheaper sets (less autograph fees) and charge more. It won't stop till collectors make them change. $200 for a box with worse than 1 in 3 chances of an autograph is just stupidity.
 
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The sad reality is that if we vote with our wallets and ESP stop producing cards we will have nothing. I doubt Select would take on the license again and Tap n Play are only emerging in this industry.

It is not like the NBA, other American sports or non sport where you can just jump into one of the other multiple releases if one is a flop.

At the moment ESP are what we have and while they have the license I would rather work with them and the dealers they supply. Elite 15 had big issues on many levels, particularly price but there was still enough good stuff in it to warrant me grabbing my teams collection which I did through dealers and other members of the site.

1/1's don't bother me. I see the perspective put forward by master set collectors but it was also added a bit of a thrill to busting a box and getting a nega hit.

The hobby is just in a low period. Prices are down on all releases and being the off season doesn't help. I, like Ross, can't wait until the next release and just hope we always have something to collect and never return to the post Dynamic pre Select era!
 
My replacement arrived today with a couple of Traders packs. It is a very nice signature, thank you to ESP for coming through.

001.jpg
002.jpg
 
edygriff21 said:
So you think buying whatever crap they dish out, and letting them increase prices every year, without increasing the quality is ok. Ffs, they took out half the autos, but increased the price by what, $4 a pack. That's just bulls***, and still you guys took the reaming they gave you. There's no transparency with this company. They refuse to show previews or checklists to collectors, yet you still support them. I'd rather have nothing than give these pricks any money. The unfortunate part about that, is that it would hurt the dealers, whom I I'd love to support. I hope they give up their licence, and let someone else take it on, because it's just been downhill so quickly after a promising 2013 release.

I'm a team/player collector myself, and have nothing against people doing that. That's what this hobby is about, collecting what you want. But it seems nrl team collectors are so much more hardcore/anal about having to have every card from every release, so there's no chance they will stop collecting. ESP knows this, so they build bigger, cheaper sets (less autograph fees) and charge more. It won't stop till collectors make them change. $200 for a box with worse than 1 in 3 chances of an autograph is just stupidity.
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Totally Agree Ed.

In 2013 i spent over 5k for boxes & Cases chasing master set.
In 2014 around the same.
In 2015 around $200 to get most of the Dragons Cards through secondary Market Because I could not see the justification in price increase for such a crap release that 2015 was.
Its a real shame because i have supported all the dealers here since 2012.
 
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