Who should be ranked higher all-time: Kobe Bryant or Tim Duncan?

SLAM Magazine's Greatest 500 players of all-time got me thinking about a Tim Duncan versus Kobe Bryant comparison.

While SLAM is just a publication and doesn't have that much significance, I still think their rankings were interesting, and some were on the money. Duncan was ranked #8 and Kobe was ranked #10, both falling below the highest ranked active player Shaq who jumped in at #4 (I think Shaq's ranking is way too high, but let's stay the course).

Here are some random "arguments" that could be used for both players, then below that I'm going to put their career achievements for comparison.

Kobe should be higher because:
- He is the greatest Laker of all-time
- He is/has been a more dominant scorer than Tim Duncan
- He has been underrated for his years when people said he relied on Shaq
- He is the most competitive player we have seen since Michael Jordan
- He is the most similar player to Michael Jordan in history

Tim should be higher because:
- He is the greatest Spur of all-time
- He is the best at his position all-time, something Kobe cannot boast
- He has been underrated because he's not flashy like Kobe
- He has not been involved in any controversies throughout his career

Career Achievements

Tim Duncan
- 4 x NBA Champion
- 3 x NBA Finals MVP
- 2 x NBA Most Valuable Player
- 1 x Rookie of the Year
- 13 x NBA All-Star
- 9 x All-NBA 1st Team
- 3 x All-NBA 2nd Team
- 1 x All-NBA 3rd Team
- 8 x All-Defensive 1st Team
- 5 x All-Defensive 2nd Team
- 1 x All-Rookie 1st Team
- 1 x NBA All-Star Game MVP

Kobe Bryant
- 5 x NBA Champion
- 2 x NBA Finals MVP
- 1 x NBA Most Valuable Player
- 13 x NBA All-Star
- 2 x NBA Scoring Champion
- 8 x All-NBA 1st Team
- 2 x All-NBA 2nd Team
- 2 x All-NBA 3rd Team
- 8 x All-Defensive 1st Team
- 2 x All-Defensive 2nd Team
- 1 x All-Rookie 2nd Team
- 4 x NBA All-Star MVP

Career Statistics

Tim Duncan (1044 games)
Averages: 20.6 PPG, 11.4 RPG, 3.1 APG, 2.3 BPG, 50.7% FG, 68.7% FT, 35.9 MPG
Totals: 21530 points, 11943 rebounds, 3276 assists, 2364 blocks (9th all-time), 37497 minutes
Career PER: 24.8 (highest 27.1)

Kobe Bryant (1089 games)
Averages: 25.2 PPG, 5.3 RPG, 4.7 APG, 1.5 SPG, 45.5% FG, 83.8% FT, 36.4 MPG
Totals: 27479 points (6th all-time), 5762 rebounds, 5089 assists, 1633 steals, 39663 minutes
Career PER: 23.5 (highest 28.0)

---------- Post added 16-03-2011 at 05:17 PM ----------

Based on this I voted for Tim Duncan.

Kobe has slightly more impressive career statistics (especially in points), but Tim Duncan has a higher PER; meaning he's been more efficient more consistently. Duncan's career achievements trump Kobe's too as he has more All-NBA and All-Defensive selections, and despite one less ring, more Finals MVP Awards and twice as many MVP's.

Add in the fact that Duncan has been the perfect teammate and team player, never uncoachable or with any disputes, and you can see why I choose him.

I think Kobe has to be ranked higher. This is because he is so clutch. Often big men are not gone to, to win the game simply because its harder to get closer the basket. When the game is on the line Kobe steps up whereas Duncan has just been fantastic for a long period of time. Just my opinion.

Heafy83 said:

I think Kobe has to be ranked higher. This is because he is so clutch. Often big men are not gone to, to win the game simply because its harder to get closer the basket. When the game is on the line Kobe steps up whereas Duncan has just been fantastic for a long period of time. Just my opinion.

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True but how many game-winners has Kobe hit in the Finals?

I'm thinking another pro-Duncan argument is this:

He has had no dominant Hall of Fame superstar on his teams that have won championships. He had Robinson, but he was well in the twilight of his career. Ginobili and Parker both make strong cases to be recognized as great all-time players, but top 100, not top 10 like Shaq!!

jimboiitmac said:

True but how many game-winners has Kobe hit in the Finals?

I'm thinking another pro-Duncan argument is this:

He has had no dominant Hall of Fame superstar on his teams that have won championships. He had Robinson, but he was well in the twilight of his career. Ginobili and Parker both make strong cases to be recognized as great all-time players, but top 100, not top 10 like Shaq!!

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it looks like kobe has hit half his clutch shots in playoffs (4/8) and duncan a third (2/6). kobe also has twice as many clutch shots made as duncan...

NBA Game Winning Shots -- leading players

tough question. no real answer. i pick duncan. at least we all agree shaq should come down a notch...

my vote is for Kobe.. and Hollingers PER is just plain BS

Kobe isnt as clutch as so many people think
Greedy as hell but not clutch

The truth about Kobe Bryant in crunch time - TrueHoop Blog - ESPN

Everyone forgets his misses, but remembers his makes.

But I would still pick him higher than Duncan

Definitely Kobe!

I voted Kobe, but Im a sucker for a flashy player over a boring, fundamental type player.

I think it's a no brainer, went with Kobe, and that's saying something........

kobe....not because he is my fav player...duncan is close though....be interesting to see if either can add another ring this year!!!!

Gotta vote for Kobe even thou I dont like him. I love TD, but the stats say it all!

TRANCEMASTER said:

Gotta vote for Kobe even thou I dont like him. I love TD, but the stats say it all!

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And the accomplishments don't?

Duncan has had KG and Dirk at his position (and C-Webb during the late 1990's) every year of his career, and still has more All-NBA 1st and All-Defensive 1st Team selections than Bryant.

IMO Duncan's 4 Rings are more impressive than Kobe's 5.

Kobe's 5 are great, but the 3 he won with Shaq he had the most DOMINANT big man in the NBA.

If Duncan had a dynamic wing on his team, no offense to Ginobili, but of the caliber of Kobe or a Wade (which is a fair comparison from the wing position to Shaq at the pivot), he would have had more than 4 rings as well.

Its very difficult to compare a Guard with a PF/C, but due to my bias i vote Duncan

Its too hard to compare in a head to head, both deserve to be up there imo but the only way you can rank them is to see who was more effective in their position. Is Duncan a better PF then Kobe is a SG, would San Antonio miss Duncan as much as LA would miss Kobe? Kobe imo is the best SG in the game right now and has been the past 8 or so years is Duncan the best PF in the league? How long did he hold that mantle? I voted Kobe

right now its tim duncan... its very very close and with that last championship kobe def. put himself really close and in the talk... if he gets one more championship (by himself haha) he probably does jump duncan on the list but right now i think you still have to keep duncan ahead... although he is the most boring player ever haha and i have hated him for a while duncan is the greatest power forward ever to play the game... kobe will get most votes because he is 'flashy, jordanesque, exciting' but that doesnt make him a 'greater' player when you actually think about what 'greatness' really is...

Verse1 said:

Its too hard to compare in a head to head, both deserve to be up there imo but the only way you can rank them is to see who was more effective in their position. Is Duncan a better PF then Kobe is a SG, would San Antonio miss Duncan as much as LA would miss Kobe? Kobe imo is the best SG in the game right now and has been the past 8 or so years is Duncan the best PF in the league? How long did he hold that mantle? I voted Kobe

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Well most would proclaim that Duncan is the best power forward of ALL-TIME while Kobe will never supplant Michael as the number one shooting guard of all-time.

And I think Duncan is not the best power forward right now, but he held that mantle for probably about 8 years as well. And I'd argue it was harder for him to keep because he had Kevin Garnett to contend with (not to mention Dirk as well).

Before seeing their achievements I would have thought Kobe a long way ahead of Duncan but, after seeing their achievements I would vote for Duncan, on greatness within the game although Kobe has contributed a lot more to the game off the court not withstanding his personal problems.

Both are great players in different ways, so can't say. But I voted KOBE because he had and still does, a bigger impact on the game.

I actually tend to disagree with the comments of Duncan being the best PF of all time. Im more inclined to say Karl Malone was. I know, he never won any rings - well, Duncan never had to beat Jordan and co. to get his rings.

magohaydz said:

I actually tend to disagree with the comments of Duncan being the best PF of all time. Im more inclined to say Karl Malone was. I know, he never won any rings - well, Duncan never had to beat Jordan and co. to get his rings.

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dont get me wrong karl malone was very very good but def. not greater then tim duncan... i dont even know if you can say malone was 2nd best PF or all time... malone had to deal with jordan for two years... what about the other 17 years of his career?

plus malone was worst then the heat in clutch moments haha