Perth PC repair person on here?

kenny3011 · Jan 1, 2011

You shouldn't really be criticizing my advice when all Im trying to do is help him, and Im pretty sure I know my stuff better than you

Sticking the screw driver to the pins wont do A SINGLE thing to you, there there to be connected to reset the CMOS, check the manual its there.

If there was anything dangerous about doing it, Id been killed a hundred times over by now.

Wockrog · Jan 1, 2011

kenny3011 said:
You shouldn't really be criticizing my advice when all Im trying to do is help him, and Im pretty sure I know my stuff better than you

Sticking the screw driver to the pins wont do A SINGLE thing to you, there there to be connected to reset the CMOS, check the manual its there.

If there was anything dangerous about doing it, Id been killed a hundred times over by now.

hang on you are misunderstanding my point, first I am by now way criticizing your advice you are probably 100 percent right but before you give that advice to someone you must know that persons level of competency, you may know where to stick the screwdriver but the person you are giving the advice to may not... result..one fried would-be repairman and if you gave him that advice legally you are liable.

kenny3011 · Jan 1, 2011

I gave the OP the advice thinking he was pretty competent on the subject of computers, he stated he has done it before and he understands all the terminology.....

And I did say check with the manual because not all motherboards have the pin in the same place....

Wockrog · Jan 1, 2011

kenny3011 said:
I gave the OP the advice thinking he was pretty competent

"Thinking" you are one brave SOB.
below is his quote
"Hmmmm..... haven't reset the BIOS via the mobo b4, will have to check that out. How about resetting the CMOS?"
doesn't sound very competent to me?

nathanblack · Jan 1, 2011

I think if the OP is interested in giving it a go, has the time and enjoys tinkering. Then no problem asking for advice and trying multiple suggestions. If you dont have time to help then dont. If he doesnt have time or knowledge to try certain things also fine.

But he needs to be aware that their are dangers like 240v inside and their is possibility not only of injury but making a $30 problem into a $1000 problem by causing more damage.

You say it doesnt boot. Does anything appear on the screen at any point? What eventually happens when you leave it on? does the fan stay on or does it shut itself down?

PSU would either do nothing if its 100% rooted or turn on momentarily. If its staying on and you hear fan and HDD then not PSU(99%)

Im still with the poster that says chech the HDD by swapping faulty into a good PC or a known good HDD into the faulty PC. Most the drivers and such are stored on HDD, so a rooted HDD would prevent booting. Though usually you would still see somethings on the screen prior to booting, ie RAM check. It would normally just go to the blue screen of death.

Not sure if you can hit Esc when powering on, or F1 or similar. Do you hear a beep for key press? does it enter bios setup etc.

Do any of the 3.5" or cd/dvd drive momentarily light up?

If so the bootdisk suggestion is a good one, although you probably dont have one hand. But could make one from a good PC.

Usually a PC looks for disk before trying the HDD so you can bypass the HDD with a disk. Then maybe enter safe mode or similar.

Maybe just put a random disc in and see what happens. It should detect the disc and prompt you thats its not recognised. You really need to get into windows or atleast dos prompt.

Not a faulty display?

If you have 1 faulty and 1 good pc or plenty of spares, cant be too hard to swap things out until its fixed.

Wockrog · Jan 1, 2011

reading the original post it wouldn't boot prior to the chopping and changing of the hardware, I reckon we need to find out what events happened prior to the event eg. did the kids play with, was there lightning strikes the night before etc etc. Start chucking in new MOBo etc and then you also have Compatability issues to deal with also.

kenny3011 · Jan 1, 2011

Captain America said:
"Thinking" you are one brave SOB.
below is his quote
"Hmmmm..... haven't reset the BIOS via the mobo b4, will have to check that out. How about resetting the CMOS?"
doesn't sound very competent to me?

I accidently said BIOS when I meant CMOS, whats the problem?

Wockrog · Jan 1, 2011

wasn't referring to your Bios/Cmos slip more so referring to his Hmmmm.....not a sound you'd want to hear dealing with 240V, anyway enough said everyone's entitled to their views. not not ruin this thread and let him achieve what he wanted, okay?

kenny3011 · Jan 1, 2011

But 240v doesn't run through the motherboard, that is converted to MUCH less by the power supply. Its not like Im telling him to go and stick the screwdriver into the PSU

But if the OP doesnt manage to find the guy with the ute dp, Id suggest going to the overclockers.com.au or whirlpool forums, there would be tonnes of computer experts who would be willing to help

nathanblack · Jan 1, 2011

Obviously the OP was aimed at one individual, but im sure it wont matter where the solution comes from.

You have a very valid point:
(1) We need background. Was their a virus, power fail, any fiddling, etc. Maybe you installed new hardware or software?
(2) After trying something, if it doesnt fix the problem. Always restore the PC to original condition so we are only dealing with the original problem and not introducing more.

So if you have ruled out Ram, then put it back how it was. Not the PSU, then put back the original PSU. Etc...

Try creating a boot disc IMO. From a good PC goto control panel -> sys_security-> backup_restore>create system restore disk

Might vary depending on your OS, but im sure you will work it out.

Good luck.

---------- Post added 01-01-2011 at 02:43 PM ----------

Kenny you are correct that the motherboard is low voltage and pretty harmless, however he could short the wrong thing like the supply rail and ground thinking its the 2pins suggest or slip accidentally and blow the motherboard = new pc. But he did sound technically inclined.

A_Iverson_I · Jan 1, 2011

Wow....... didn't think this thread would go so crazy LOL...... anyway, pretty busy at the moment so don't have the time to reply/try everything suggested just yet, but just wanted to reply so you know I have been reading the thread & appreciate all the advice.

FTR..... Kenny is right for the most part that I am pretty competent when it comes to PC's...... as I said in the OP I usually can fix these things myself, but just this time it has me stumped.... I'm no PC tech that's for sure, but I know more than the average Joe.

As for software suggestions/problems/corrupt files....... surely this wouldn't prevent the PC from booting up & getting into BIOS at least..... as I said, the PC doesn't even "beep".

Edit: Btw...... I actually found the guy with the blue ute, but alas, he was in Vic I think...... so no go there haha

Wockrog · Jan 1, 2011

like the last few post suggests need to know what happened prior to the crash?

A_Iverson_I · Jan 1, 2011

I will find out & let you know.

nathanblack · Jan 1, 2011

Also exactly what happens when you turn it on. I pressume you get a green light for power? Anything momentarily displyed on screen? Blank? Black?Blue?
Im guessing completely blank screen.
Then what? The green light stays on? Does the HDD indicator flash like its trying to access it? Is the fan still running?How does it turn off? By itself or you press and hold the power on/off button for few seconds?
Any info would help.
Its unlikely to be PSU. (a) its powering on and staying on, (b) you changed the psu. You could check a few voltages on the main board to make sure you getting +/-5V or +/-12V, but I think its safe to say PSU is fine.

Are you 100% sure its not something stupid like a dead monitor/display? ie it is booting you just cant see it?

Im assuming its a desktop.

You really only have monitor + CPU

In the CPU you have some periphial boards like sound card etc. The PSU, RAM, HDD and the mother board.

The periphials wont be an issue. So if its not PSU or monitor, it doesnt leave much.

Your confident about the RAM, im not so sure if its not even getting to the point of counting the RAM on the screen. You probably have some onboard RAM too, so could try taking all 4 RAM out.

You really just need a working computer to rule out everything 1 by 1 IMO.

If you can confirm RAM and HDD in another PC, then all that is left is an actual fault on the mother board which can happen and you arent going to repair it at component level. Try a good clean, reseat everything and then bite the bullet and replace the board.

Its not hard to test HDD and RAM, all the IDE connections are same.

Wockrog · Jan 2, 2011

One thing confuses me... he says he can't afford a techie but he bought a new motherboard needlessly, either boards have gone down in price since I last bought one or it's a cheapie...having said that I think Nathan is and can put you on the right track so I am unsubscribing from this post best of luck all...sorry if I offended anyone

A_Iverson_I · Jan 3, 2011

Ok... got around to trying it out again, here are some answers.

You say it doesnt boot. Does anything appear on the screen at any point? What eventually happens when you leave it on? does the fan stay on or does it shut itself down?

Nothing appears on the screen at all.

Well you can't really leave it on..... as soon as it press the button it pretty much shuts itself off, the fan doesn't even have a chance to start spinning... though it does move, just doesn't get to actual spinning.

Do any of the 3.5" or cd/dvd drive momentarily light up?

The only lights I see light up are the floppy & the dvd drive.

like the last few post suggests need to know what happened prior to the crash?

Ok, he told me that prior to it totally crashing it was crashing every now & then.

Im assuming its a desktop.

Yes!

One thing confuses me... he says he can't afford a techie but he bought a new motherboard needlessly, either boards have gone down in price since I last bought one or it's a cheapie...having said that I think Nathan is and can put you on the right track so I am unsubscribing from this post best of luck all...sorry if I offended anyone

Don't think I said he couldn't afford a techie, just said the price was rather high. As for buying the mobo, well in my experience with stuff like this it it usually the mobo 90% of the time & since we ruled out other things before buying the CPU he went ahead & got the new (ebay new) mobo.

nathanblack · Jan 3, 2011

If its turning off that quickly, then PSU is most likely issue. Either its blown and has little/no output or its working fine but is being shorted somewhere on the mother board.

I know you have already swapped out PSU but maybe both are faulty or the 'secondhand' PSU has lower power out specs.

If you have a multimeter it certainly cant hurt to check the output of the PSU. Obviously input is 240V. The high voltage cant be accessed without removing metal case around PSU, so your pretty safe. Disconnect the output of the PSU from the motherboard and measure direct from connector.

I do think its important that you have restored the PC to original faulty condition before trying different things. So put the original mobo back in. Otherwise you cant be sure if its compatible. Did the new mobo come with a cpu chip or did you take it of the old board?

I once had your fault when the fan stopped working and the process overheated and instead off shutting down and saving the processor, the pc stayed on until the processor burnt out.

If the output of PSU is good, and you suspect a short is causing it, then perhaps a good clean of the board to remove dust. Use a paint brush or similar. If you have circuit board cleaner try that too. Then disconnect and reconnect all cable. Push on the ic to seat them in sockets firmly, etc.

Im not sure how confident you are of the new mobo and psu, because logically the fault needs to be with one of them.

Even if it was as simple as the fan being fault, then it should stay on 30sec plus before overheating and shutting down.

Goodluck mate.

A_Iverson_I · Jan 4, 2011

No multimeter unfortunately

I do think its important that you have restored the PC to original faulty condition before trying different things. So put the original mobo back in. Otherwise you cant be sure if its compatible. Did the new mobo come with a cpu chip or did you take it of the old board?

Ok..... put the old mobo back in & now things are slightly different. When you first push the power button it starts up for a couple seconds & then reboots itself.... it then keeps running until i turn it off, however nothing appears on the screen other than a "no signal"... when I first turn the monitor on I see an "Asus Logo" thing, but then it goes to a "no signal" message. Floppy light stays on & a green led on the mobo is on too & both the CPU fan & Video Card fan spinning fine.

Did the new mobo come with a cpu chip or did you take it of the old board?

Using the same CPU from the old board.... both new & old board should support it fine. Old board is an Asus P5K-E Wifi & new board is a Gigabyte P35-DS3R.

If the output of PSU is good, and you suspect a short is causing it, then perhaps a good clean of the board to remove dust. Use a paint brush or similar. If you have circuit board cleaner try that too. Then disconnect and reconnect all cable. Push on the ic to seat them in sockets firmly, etc.

Yes, that's one of the first things we did. There isn't really any dust left on the mobo anymore & the new board was brand new (even though it was bought from ebay) so had no dust.

I could try the PSU from my machine, but now that it runs until I turn it off with the old board it's unlikely to be the PSU right?

Thanks for all your help!

nathanblack · Jan 4, 2011

PSU sounds fine.

The splash screen "Asus logo" is first thing loaded from bios, unless you disable it.
The next thing is Video card.
Followed by RAM test. In that order.

You have said previously that it isnt getting to the stage where it counts the RAM.

So video or RAM are the most likely causes, especially if its shared memory.

When you tried to clear CMOS did you only disconnect the battery? The correct method is with power off and disconnected, remove the battery. Next to the battery there should be a jumper. From memory pins 1+2 are "connected". Remove the jumper and place on pins 2+3 instead. Wait 5mins. Return jumper to pins 1+2. Re-install battery.You can then plug in and power on.

Before doing that, check what happens when you reset from the current state. You say its turning on and staying on. So you can warm start by hitting rest button, or cold start by pressing and holding power button for few seconds. Are symptoms same for both cold and warm start?

Also you mention "beep" and "no beep"

So try removing ALL RAM and power on. It SHOULD beep to tell you theirs no RAM. Power off.

Next try 1 stick only. Put it in the slot furthest from the cpu. Slot 4 I think? Power on. Does it still beep? No beep? Count RAM?

Then if still no good try the reset of CMOS.

Until you iscolate the problem, only use 1 stick of RAM IMO. Repeat the above steps after clearing CMOS.

If you have a "spare" video card definately worth trying first. After all it is the first thing loaded by BIOS, and you are hitting a wall either at or sortly after that point.

A_Iverson_I · Jan 5, 2011

The splash screen "Asus logo" is first thing loaded from bios, unless you disable it.

Not sure if it matters, but the Monitor is an Asus as well..... any chance that displays that because of the Monitor & not the Motherboard? Well think it does, as just checked & if I turn the monitor on without having the PC on it still shows the Asus logo.

The next thing is Video card.
Followed by RAM test. In that order.

Click to expand...

Tested it without the video card & tested RAM one by one... including different slots...... no change.

When you tried to clear CMOS did you only disconnect the battery? The correct method is with power off and disconnected, remove the battery. Next to the battery there should be a jumper. From memory pins 1+2 are "connected". Remove the jumper and place on pins 2+3 instead. Wait 5mins. Return jumper to pins 1+2. Re-install battery.You can then plug in and power on.

Click to expand...

Yep.... that's what I did earlier on this board, as instructed by the manual. No change.

Before doing that, check what happens when you reset from the current state. You say its turning on and staying on. So you can warm start by hitting rest button, or cold start by pressing and holding power button for few seconds. Are symptoms same for both cold and warm start?

Click to expand...

Tried that but same symptoms.

So try removing ALL RAM and power on. It SHOULD beep to tell you theirs no RAM. Power off.

Click to expand...

Tried that...... does exactly the same thing. No beeps at all.

Next try 1 stick only. Put it in the slot furthest from the cpu. Slot 4 I think? Power on. Does it still beep? No beep? Count RAM?

Click to expand...

Tried that... no change.

Also..... I left it on to see how long it would run without me turning it off...... runs for about 1 minute before turning off.

Perth PC repair person on here?

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