One For The Ages.....

[WoobieZarz]

EDIT:
Be sure to read all of this before deciding!!!


Righto, sitting here watching an MJ DVD (His Airness), and there's a segment on Top 10 Plays, Dunks, Assists, and Clutch Shots.

It all got me thinking...

Who is the better player, MJ or Kobe...

Now hear my argument first, then you decide.

Ignoring NBA Championships, the only thing in my eyes, is MJ was a better Defender, or was he? He won more Awards than Kobe, but his all-time stats are:

All-Time Stats

MJ:
30.1PPG
5.3STLS
.893APG (LESS THAN 1!!!)
6.2RPG
49.7%FG
32.7%3PT
83.5%FT

In 1072 Games

Kobe:
24.6PPG
1.5SPG
4.5APG
5.2RPG
45.3%FG
33.7%3PT
83.8%FT

In 784 Games

Now, I continue my arguement....

Take a look at the defensive, MJ was better, that's obvious.

What about on offense.... He averaged more points than Kobe, but Kobe had more Assists than MJ. 4 to be precise... that's possibly 8 points, or 12 points, depending which way you go about it.

Add that to Kobes scoring average, and he could be averaging 30PPG too.

In Chicago, MJ took all the shots, that's obvious, in LA, Kobe takes all the shots.

In Chicago, MJ had Pippen, in LA, Kobe has.... well not exactly Pippen, but he has Odom.

In Chicago, MJ also had Rodman, Kukoc, Kerr, Harper, and so on.

In LA, Kobe HAD Shaq.... and now has well he's still got Odom.

So I put the vote out. Who really was the better player, not the better team winning the Championships (as you could say Bill Russell was/is better than MJ, but that's another arguement), I'm talking the better PLAYER....

My Vote says Kobe.


2nd EDIT:

Back in the 80s the NBA had NEVER seen such athletic player before, in the 90s the NBA was introduced to other High Flying athletic players, Kobe, Carter, T-Mac, etc, etc, etc....

 

[martyaud]

huh ??

MJ avg less than 1 assist per game ??

dont think so... its more like 5.3

http://www.nba.com/history/players/jordan_stats.html

the 0.83 is blocks !!!

 

[gemz23]

EDIT:
Be sure to read all of this before deciding!!!


Righto, sitting here watching an MJ DVD (His Airness), and there's a segment on Top 10 Plays, Dunks, Assists, and Clutch Shots.

It all got me thinking...

Who is the better player, MJ or Kobe...

Now hear my argument first, then you decide.

Ignoring NBA Championships, the only thing in my eyes, is MJ was a better Defender, or was he? He won more Awards than Kobe, but his all-time stats are:

All-Time Stats

MJ:
30.1PPG
5.3STLS
.893APG (LESS THAN 1!!!)
6.2RPG
49.7%FG
32.7%3PT
83.5%FT

In 1072 Games

Kobe:
24.6PPG
1.5SPG
4.5APG
5.2RPG
45.3%FG
33.7%3PT
83.8%FT

In 784 Games

Now, I continue my arguement....

Take a look at the defensive, MJ was better, that's obvious.

What about on offense.... He averaged more points than Kobe, but Kobe had more Assists than MJ. 4 to be precise... that's possibly 8 points, or 12 points, depending which way you go about it.

Add that to Kobes scoring average, and he could be averaging 30PPG too.

In Chicago, MJ took all the shots, that's obvious, in LA, Kobe takes all the shots.

In Chicago, MJ had Pippen, in LA, Kobe has.... well not exactly Pippen, but he has Odom.

In Chicago, MJ also had Rodman, Kukoc, Kerr, Harper, and so on.

In LA, Kobe HAD Shaq.... and now has well he's still got Odom.

So I put the vote out. Who really was the better player, not the better team winning the Championships (as you could say Bill Russell was/is better than MJ, but that's another arguement), I'm talking the better PLAYER....

My Vote says Kobe.


2nd EDIT:

Back in the 80s the NBA had NEVER seen such athletic player before, in the 90s the NBA was introduced to other High Flying athletic players, Kobe, Carter, T-Mac, etc, etc, etc....

mavz u got a few of MJ stats wrong so there maybe no argument after all. in my opinion kobe is up there just not in the level of mj,magic,bird,etc.

 

[SPREE FAN]

you are too funny scotty

put the beer down and go to bed, MJ is clearly better even if you did mix his stats up

 

[nenjabin]

Hahaha Uhhh less than 1 APG and 5.3 STPG? Dude, even if these stats were real, then 5.3STPG compared to Kobe's 1.5, despite you having Kobe up on assists by 4 (with your messed up stats), it's harder to average that many steals = MJ still wins! Made for funny reading though, given you're explaining yourself on incorrect data...and didn;t notice...

 

[chadjaja]

Well seeing its just 'who is better?'

Lets see....

Both are adulterers.
But one of Kobe's was a rape charge.
Jordan has had many betting scandals.
But Jordan got teammates to play for him.
Kobe is hated by his..
MJ turned up for team USA
Kobe hasn't much
MJ trashed talked mostly on court.
Kobe thru the media
Jordan made too many comebacks
Kobe hasn't retired yet.

Based on my "Santa's have you been good or bad" book and guide I say Jordan still has the edge.

I had to come to this conclusion as the question was too broad and your stats and arguments made it hard to compare them in their skill and stats alone.

 

[WoobieZarz]

I dunno what happend there then, I can never find the right bio pages on nba.com so I used Google to search for it, and went from there.

Oh well, I f-cked it up.

So everyone says MJ? No sweat, I still say Kobe.

 

[martyaud]

Well seeing its just 'who is better?'

Lets see....

Both are adulterers.
But one of Kobe's was a rape charge.
Jordan has had many betting scandals.
But Jordan got teammates to play for him.
Kobe is hated by his..
MJ turned up for team USA
Kobe hasn't much
MJ trashed talked mostly on court.
Kobe thru the media
Jordan made too many comebacks
Kobe hasn't retired yet.

Based on my "Santa's have you been good or bad" book and guide I say Jordan still has the edge.

I had to come to this conclusion as the question was too broad and your stats and arguments made it hard to compare them in their skill and stats alone.

hahaha.... Chad's criteria are much better.....

 

[fastbaja5b]

Can I be controversial and say Brons better than the pair of them? Sure some may say he choked a bit in the finals, but he's younger than most members of the forums! And remember Kobe in his first playoffs? 4 straight airball 3's in crunch time!

 

[WoobieZarz]

You could be controversial....

I'm not convinced with Lebron yet. To be one of the best, you have to handle the crunch, after all, that's what MJ & Kobe are famous for.

 

[m4x77]

Kobe is nowhere near MJ <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

 

[Benny J]

Kobe is nowhere near MJ <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

Agreed....MJ was better for longer. There is no doubt Kobe is bloody good....but better than Jordan...no mate....

 

[WoobieZarz]

Why not elaborate on your statements....

I could say Hakeem Olajuwon was better than Wilt Chamberlain. But I'd need to back it up....

So how about it...

 

[nenjabin]

Why not elaborate on your statements....

I could say Hakeem Olajuwon was better than Wilt Chamberlain. But I'd need to back it up....

So how about it...

I think 1 thing that makes Jordan better is that he averaged what he did with an awesome support cast. Kobe didn;t score this much when he had Shaq, yet Jordan had Pippen with him the whole way.
Argueably another reason for Jordan, people wanted to play with him. People patently do not want to play with Kobe, hence no support cast.

 

[m4x77]

Do we need to ...comon man be real every kid in every country on every continent wants to be like Mike!!!!Whats Kobe done to be the GREATEST??
And yeah if Mj had Shaq ..m8 they will be ......80/2 maby 81/1 !!!And yeah you ask every player who ever play the game who they want to have as a team mate 98% would say MIKE..
Rest my case...PEACE

 

[WoobieZarz]

Fill a team full of good players and they're bound to win.

I know MJ lead the Bulls to their 6 Championships, but MJ didnt do it all...

They both have very similar games, teamleaders, scoring champions, etc.

Kobe won 3 rings with Shaq, and then the Lakers went down hill from there.
If Shaq had stayed, and the Lakers won another 3, then what??

Nothing would have changed, Kobe would have 3 more rings, and that's that. Would MJ still be THE MAN?

Obviously supporting cast has had the biggest impact on MJs career, with players wanting to play with him, but does that make MJ a better player, or a better team mate?

After all, it's about being the better player.

 

[m4x77]

Man you said it all !!! Kobe won with Shaq without him HE CAN NOT WIN......Mj made a comback @40 or 41 and his Wizards Almost made playoffs missed it by one game !!!!!!! @41 and kobe @his prime hardly gets to playoffs without Shaq...comone man!!!! MJ is the best!!!

 

[WoobieZarz]

It's still not enough to convince me. Maybe I'm anti - "MJ = Greatest", but I just don't see why he's ALL THAT.

I'm not good with my history, but wasnt MJs last title 95-96? I can't remember. That was the year when KG & Stackhouse entered the league. There wasnt really a LOT of athletic/entertaining stars back then....

Hence, MJ got all the coverage. That and he was worth a shit load of money, so they HAD to give him the coverage (just listen to David Stern when he's awarding him the MVP awards, and Championships, etc).

Put it this way, if MJ didnt have Pippen, or any other "decent" help, would he have still won....

Who'd the Wizards have when MJ came back? Didnt they have Jamison then, or was he a Mav then? Again, I'm no good with my history.

 

[mattyj]

haha this is stupid...Kobe should not even be in the discussion with Jordan untill he prooves he can win without Shaq

He may be Jordans equal in scoring, maybe, but in every other part of the game Jordan is vastly superior, including passing, even if he did average less than 1APG

btw Scotty, you should check out www.basketball-reference.com has a pretty cool comparison thingo for just this sorta thing

 

[WoobieZarz]

Thanks for the link Matty, not seen that one before.

But, where was MJ vastly superior?