NRL Rumour Mill Thread (Spoilers)

I feel sorriest for that hard core group who go to every game, rain shine or hail.

Funny buggers too.

Sad to see that some of their heroes, or some at their club, would let them down like this.

And this from elsewhere (despite the light hearted jibes, I do actually care for the Sharks.)


The NRL will not be taking over the club,they have appointed an interim CEO, financially assisted the club,until the club is stabilised.The club has a licence to play at Shark Park,and only complete financial oblivion would force relocation.The $300m development,has provided a decent underpinning,plus the huge reduction in the club's debt.
The fat lady hasn't sung yet.

This was posted on Facebook by Rachel Givney daughter of the sacked Sharks doctor. Not sure how real this is?

TO EVERY CRONULLA FAN. You deserve to know the truth.

The man in this picture kneeling at the end of the front row, left side, is Doctor David Givney.

This is him as the Australian Team Doctor during a recent Four Nations victory in England.

He is also a Team Doctor for NSW State of Origin.

He was the Doctor of your club up until yesterday, when he was sacked, alongside four of his colleagues including coach Shane Flanagan and physio Konrad Schultz.

Doctor Givney has been with Cronulla since 1987. This was to be his 27th season with the club.

In 2011, The Doc turned up to a pre-season game to discover that (now former) Training Manager TRENT ELKIN had employed a 'sports scientist' named Stephen Danks, who had recently left Manly after five years.

The Doc was not informed, nor consulted about this decision. In fact, efforts were repeatedly made by Elkin to keep Doctor Givney away from Stephen Danks.

Shortly after, The Doc discovered mysterious heavy bruising on some of his players. After investigating this, he discovered that Danks had been secretly injecting them with warfarin, a blood thinning medicine, in a pseudo-scientific attempt to increase oxygen flow.

Concerned about the welfare of his beloved players, the Doc confronted Danks and Elkin about what they were doing. When they refused to tell him, Doctor Givney resigned from the Sharks in protest.

The resulting uproar from the players and officials upon hearing that the Doc had quit caused the Cronulla Board to step in. They refused to accept the Doc's resignation and they fired Stephen Danks.

At no point did the Doc witness any player being administered a WADA banned substance and to his knowledge, no player ever knowingly consumed a banned substance. There are no failed drugs tests and there is no hard evidence that any Cronulla player ever took a banned substance. While Danks' practices were certainly dodgy, they weren't, in this instance, illegal.

This all happened over the course of 4 weeks in pre-season 2011. Once the Doc discovered Danks' dodgy ways, Danks was fired.

Stephen Danks was at Manly for five years and Essendon for almost two. Manly, one of the wealthiest clubs in the League, has not been questioned once about its involvement with Danks.

And TRENT ELKIN left Cronulla at the end of 2012 and now works for Parramatta. He recently turned witness for ASADA in a deal for immunity against prosecution.

These are the facts of the case and they are undisputed.

Dr David Givney was more than just a doctor to these players. He was 'The Doc', their friend and confidante, loyal to the club through thick and thin and scrupulous to the point of resigning his job to bring about the removal of a person he believed was harming his players.

The reason I am talking about David Givney a lot is because he is my father. But the other four men have families too who will also be devastated by this and my heart goes out to them.

Matt26 said:

This was posted on Facebook by Rachel Givney daughter of the sacked Sharks doctor. Not sure how real this is?

TO EVERY CRONULLA FAN. You deserve to know the truth.

The man in this picture kneeling at the end of the front row, left side, is Doctor David Givney.

This is him as the Australian Team Doctor during a recent Four Nations victory in England.

He is also a Team Doctor for NSW State of Origin.

He was the Doctor of your club up until yesterday, when he was sacked, alongside four of his colleagues including coach Shane Flanagan and physio Konrad Schultz.

Doctor Givney has been with Cronulla since 1987. This was to be his 27th season with the club.

In 2011, The Doc turned up to a pre-season game to discover that (now former) Training Manager TRENT ELKIN had employed a 'sports scientist' named Stephen Danks, who had recently left Manly after five years.

The Doc was not informed, nor consulted about this decision. In fact, efforts were repeatedly made by Elkin to keep Doctor Givney away from Stephen Danks.

Shortly after, The Doc discovered mysterious heavy bruising on some of his players. After investigating this, he discovered that Danks had been secretly injecting them with warfarin, a blood thinning medicine, in a pseudo-scientific attempt to increase oxygen flow.

Concerned about the welfare of his beloved players, the Doc confronted Danks and Elkin about what they were doing. When they refused to tell him, Doctor Givney resigned from the Sharks in protest.

The resulting uproar from the players and officials upon hearing that the Doc had quit caused the Cronulla Board to step in. They refused to accept the Doc's resignation and they fired Stephen Danks.

At no point did the Doc witness any player being administered a WADA banned substance and to his knowledge, no player ever knowingly consumed a banned substance. There are no failed drugs tests and there is no hard evidence that any Cronulla player ever took a banned substance. While Danks' practices were certainly dodgy, they weren't, in this instance, illegal.

This all happened over the course of 4 weeks in pre-season 2011. Once the Doc discovered Danks' dodgy ways, Danks was fired.

Stephen Danks was at Manly for five years and Essendon for almost two. Manly, one of the wealthiest clubs in the League, has not been questioned once about its involvement with Danks.

And TRENT ELKIN left Cronulla at the end of 2012 and now works for Parramatta. He recently turned witness for ASADA in a deal for immunity against prosecution.

These are the facts of the case and they are undisputed.

Dr David Givney was more than just a doctor to these players. He was 'The Doc', their friend and confidante, loyal to the club through thick and thin and scrupulous to the point of resigning his job to bring about the removal of a person he believed was harming his players.

The reason I am talking about David Givney a lot is because he is my father. But the other four men have families too who will also be devastated by this and my heart goes out to them.

Click to expand...

That's all fine, and if it was only '4 weeks' in 2011 pre-season, so why wasn't it cleared up then, between the club, the NRL and ASADA, etc?

The Mad Hatter said:

That's all fine, and if it was only '4 weeks' in 2011 pre-season, so why wasn't it cleared up then, between the club, the NRL and ASADA, etc?

Click to expand...

Because we have muppets running the game and the poor old Sharks are an easy target.

ooneil said:

Because we have muppets running the game and the poor old Sharks are an easy target.

Click to expand...

Should that be 'ruining' the game?

Seriously though. This should have been dealt with.

It sounds more and more like the players are going to be hung out to dry.

Lets hope common sense prevails and natural justice s served

Manly CEO has today rejected the rumours going around as totally untrue.

Dr Grange said:

You need to stop smoking that weed it's starting to cloud you vision & thoughts.
How would you like people to start throwing bullsh!t out about your spinless dragons your just as bad as the labour stooges.
Get some facts 1st !!!!!

Click to expand...

man its only rumours feel free to fire away at the dragons or any other club. thats what he heard so he posts it up, i highly doubt he's throwing bullshi" just to stir shi? up

The Cronulla Sharks board stood down coach Shane Flanagan and sacked four other key staff members because the directors believe they knew about alleged doping procedures at the club and kept it hidden.
The board believe Flanagan had enough evidence of the alleged doping to ban the practice and report this to the board. A club insider said the board claimed that when injections began on the eve of the 2011 season, Flanagan allegedly said: ''I don't want to know about this.''
The board believes the other members of the football department did not act responsibly. Football manager Darren Mooney, club doctor David Givney, head trainer Mark Noakes and physiotherapist Konrad Schultz were sacked on Friday.
Mooney reported to the board on a monthly basis but did not say anything about the alleged doping practices until May 29, 2011. It is understood it was Mooney, not Flanagan or Givney, who finally sacked controversial sports scientist Stephen Dank. Nor did Givney make any earlier protests about injections to the board. His sacking has caused considerable angst for directors with whom he has been close. They maintain he should have prevented injections being given by people other than trained doctors and nurses.
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Two pieces of legal advice, including one from Alan Sullivan, QC, recommended sacking the five, including Noakes and Schultz, who were also employed in 2011. The Cronulla board engaged lawyers more than two weeks ago and the advice to dismiss was carefully considered. The choice of Trish Kavanagh, a former board member of ASADA, now ASADA, and an arbitrator on the Court of Arbitration for Sport, has been suggested to have assisted in demonstrating the Sharks were not a party to a ''blokey cover-up.''
When contacted by Fairfax Media on Saturday, Flanagan said: ''Stephen Dank was involved with our strength and conditioning coach Trent Elkin. There were procedures we were not happy with. We had a meeting with our staff and there were clear and defined guidelines given not to proceed. There was a communication breakdown between Dank and our doctor. Eventually Dank was told not to have anything to do with our club. We couldn't take the risk of anything he was doing.''
The NRL/AFL doping scandal could blow up this season's schedule, and result in the obliteration of clubs, the early retirement of players, the ripping up of broadcasting contracts and strict new guidelines on the employment of staff at all clubs.
The near death sentence given the Storm because of their salary-cap breaches could be duplicated across the football landscape. Many believe that if this is necessary to force clubs and players to abide by world-wide doping rules, so be it. The Sharks and their players are the first casualties.
THE CLUB
Cronulla could disappear. WADA rules state that if two players from the one team are found guilty of doping, the team can be banned. Fourteen Sharks players face serious doping charges from the 2011 season, with only three likely to be cleared.
If rugby league wants to play internationally and receive federal grants, it must abide by WADA rules. Five women players from the recent North Korea FIFA World Cup were found guilty of doping and
banned for two years. However, the North Korean women's soccer team are banned from the next World Cup, effectively a four-year ban, punishing players who were not even members of the last World Cup squad.
If Australia wishes to compete in the Rugby League World Cup this year, the Sharks may have to take the fall. The Sharks believe their co-operation with ASADA will save the club from sanction but are unsure of the WADA implications.
Even if legal matters delay a WADA decision, Cronulla insiders fear the NRL's ongoing support of the Sharks could obligate them to re-locate to Perth in four years. Cancelling the Sharks' NRL licence to please WADA would void the recently agreed $1.2 billion broadcasting deal, which depends on eight games a week. The deal in the AFL, where Essendon is in jeopardy, demands nine games a week.
SHARKS PLAYERS
Fourteen current Sharks players have been offered six-month bans and the Sharks believe NRL/ASADA rules allow them to pay the players during their suspension, although ASADA bans suspended players from even training on club premises.
The players argue they were not told the substances breached anti-doping rules. Players are responsible for what enters their bodies, however. A Bulgarian gymnast, Andreea Raducan, lost a gold medal at the Sydney Olympics because she tested positive to a banned substance she believed was safe that was administered by her coach.
Sharks players have also argued the substances were not on the banned list. This is wrong. Two of the substances allegedly used were on the WADA prohibited-substances list. Players were allegedly injected initially, then given lozenges and finally a cream to rub into their biceps. ASADA officials argue they should have asked questions first.
The injections allegedly began in the Sharks' away dressing room on the Friday night before the first game of the 2011 season. They continued until April, 2011 when one player, believed to be Isaac Gordon, complained of bruising. When Givney, as club doctor, said he would have to give Gordon an injection, the wing/fullback said: ''Not another injection.''
Givney began asking questions, protesting to strength and conditioning coach Trent Elkin, who allegedly told him to ''piss off''. However, the performance and strength program continued, including the alleged use of lozenges, then the cream. There is a suggestion three Sharks players continued to see Dank, brought to the club by Elkin, after the club gave him his marching orders. Dank and Elkin have denied any wrongdoing.
OTHER NRL AND AFL PLAYERS
When the Sharks contacted potential spin doctors and other NRL/AFL clubs, they received an indication of the widespread nature of the scandal. One PR consultant declined, saying he was already employed by Newcastle. The Knights have two former Sharks from the 2011 season, Jeremy Smith and Kade Snowden, on their roster.
When the Sharks called Essendon to see if they could share information on strategies, they received no assistance. All 25 players at the Sharks in 2011 are being investigated and a further nine players are under scrutiny. One NRL club has quizzed a former Sharks player who reports seeing the use of cream but was never a user himself. People are asking about Manly, where Dank worked for five years, much longer than his stay at Cronulla.
THE TRAINER AND THE SPORTS SCIENTIST
The Sharks believe Elkin is the key figure in the scandal. He brought Dank to the club. They allege he initially injected himself to show the safety of the product. Elkin was seen at NRL headquarters about a month ago and it is believed ASADA have been receiving information from Customs, the ACC and Federal Police about shipments of banned substances from China being distributed by motorcycle gangs.
Fairfax Media has been told Elkin's phone was tapped. A Sharks insider says there is evidence of Elkin standing in the dressing room with vials behind his back to avoid TV cameras. Elkin left the club last year and is now a trainer at Parramatta.
The Eels have declared their faith in him, causing angst with Sharks players, who point to Parramatta's support of Elkin, compared with the standing down and sacking of their coach, manager, doctor, trainer and masseur. It is uncertain whether ASADA has offered Elkin indemnity but should this be so, it will cause anger across the NRL, given its opposition to the ''give-up'' mentality. However, Elkin has strong support from Flanagan and the Cronulla football department, who believe that he nearly told ASADA when he met with them in Canberra that the players were using legal supplements supplied by Dank. Earlier, when the club was drug-tested and no players returned a positive result, there was a confidence that the products were legal.
SHARKS BOARD
Five of the nine-man Cronulla board were not directors in 2011. Chairman Damian Irvine is overseas and was to return on Saturday night, on the eve of the opening game against the Titans. Elections are due in a month.
Irvine seemed willing to fulfill the joint role of chairman and interim chief executive. He is popular with season ticket holders and is one of the first in the dressing room, yet his critics claim he is first and foremost a fan rather than a chairman who closely watches all aspects of the club.
There is a suggestion some directors will not continue unless a chairman demonstrating greater distance from the players and staff takes control.
THE SHARKS AND THE NRL
The Sharks were called to the NRL last week for a meeting with ASADA, where they were told the extent of the information gained. The club had been conducting its own inquiries and reached similar conclusions. It was then the Sharks doubted whether any of their players could succeed with a ''not my fault'' defence.
ASADA offered six-month bans in exchange for guilty pleas and the Sharks sweetened this with a commitment to keep paying them. The players rejected the offer.
The Sharks board accept that their coaching/training staff have been negligent and will stand by their players. The Sharks players are furious and met at a local hotel with three former players, now directors, Jonathan Docking, Glenn Coleman and Phil Tiernan. After 45 minutes of vitriol, the players settled and some understood the club's stance.


Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-league/league-news/sharks-allege-coverup-20130309-2fsj7.html#ixzz2N2aKyi2A

He's been quiet for some time but Stephen Dank, the sports scientist at the centre of the drugs-in-sport investigation, is getting on the front foot. He says it's time for the Australian Sports Anti-Doping Authority to put up or shut up. And what's more, his legal team is offering to support the embattled Sharks players. ''We've offered our services to the Cronulla players,'' said Dank's lawyer Greg Stanton. Stanton says Dank wants the case resolved in a hurry. In a letter to ASADA, Stanton jumped into the drugs body. ''We cannot sensibly or significantly seek Mr Dank's consent to this process, when as a glaring omission from the matters addressed in your correspondence, no specific or general allegation appear to be available against him. We are left to conjecture as to the real purpose of this interview and the extent to which he is currently exposed, on the material available to ASADA, specifically as to his involvement in any breach that is said to have occurred. It is neither our client's intentions nor desire to frustrate or impede any valid and properly constituted inquiry.'' Stanton added ''the sole purpose in responding to the ASADA invitation was to seek an immediate and decisive resolution. We have called from the outset for the evidence, if any, of any violation for which it is said Dank is liable. Rather than alleging any wrongdoing, ASADA is encouraging and promoting a newly devised scheme of 'do it yourself' styled prosecution. So poorly and clumsily has this process been mishandled that any prosecution that may unfold from this point would be in serious peril of failing, poisoned as a monumental abuse of process.''

Shameful treatment

Sharks coach Shane Flanagan was treated as an outsider by the club that stood him down. He gave his heart and soul to the club. Flanagan had been kept in the dark by club officials and its board during the most tumultuous period in Cronulla's history. Those close to Flanagan say that board members had refused to communicate with him either by phone or email to let him know the status his club was in and the problems they faced. Flanagan tried repeatedly to get information about the crisis his players were facing. However, on every occasion he was knocked back. Flanagan was banned from speaking to the media by the club and forced to watch on as his players and his former trainer, Trent Elkin, were dragged into a most unpleasant situation. It is known that Flanagan was sounded out by a couple of clubs last year. There have been whispers that the Dragons were interested. That has yet to be relayed to Flanagan. He had sat down with Elkin and confronted him about the allegations of illegal drug use at the club. When the pair met, Elkin is said to have looked Flanagan in the eye and promised that anything he did at the Sharks was legal. That clearly hasn't stopped Cronulla players' anger being directed at their former strength and conditioning coach.
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Don't be fooled

The Sharks' early-evening news conference on Friday was an exercise in spin and self-protection, and nothing more. It was held at a time designed to make it difficult for television news bulletins and newspaper deadlines - it was a classic Friday evening bad news release in the hope of minimising the impact. The news conference failed on every level. You had to feel sorry for Sharks deputy chairman Keith Ward - he was clearly out of his depth facing an angry media pack who had been given no answers for more than three weeks. However, it was the smug performance from from former deputy chairwoman of the Australian Sports Drug Agency Dr Tricia Kavanagh that did the Sharks the biggest disservice. The contempt she showed and the belittling nature of her answers should ensure that she is never put up to represent the Sharks again. She appeared to have no idea of the hurt the Cronulla club and its fans are going through and, more to the point, the way those who were sacked and stood down would feel. The whole reason the news conference was held was to protect the board members. The reason given for the standings-down was ''management deficiencies''. The reason that was offered as an explanation was to hopefully prevent Sharks players from suing the club. If the board could say they knew nothing of what was going on because of bumbling management, they could not be viewed as liable for the players being given substances ASADA is determined to prove are illegal. For the entire week, Sharks media manager Rob Willis was forced to fend off every journalist in town and beyond. Willis did a great job in difficult circumstances and if the Sharks want to get out of this mess, he should be given a greater role in ongoing communications


Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-league/league-news/dank-puts-ball-in-asadas-court-20130309-2fsda.html#ixzz2N2bghTF6

Like i've said previously, not worth believing anything anyone says until they come out and officially name certain players with actual proof. The way that this whole situation has been handled is just comical...and i really can't understand why you would come out and say players/staff from a club have been doping/cheating when you haven't provided any proof at all, it's just really unprofessional and especially with these rumours of offering 6 month bans as a deal it seems like they are trying to trick players into confessing because they haven't got the evidence. Usually you get the evidence then you make an announcement/take action with actual proof on hand.

The above account contradicts Givney's daughter's story - 4 weeks during the 2011 pre-season vs well into April 2011.

Lance Armstrong never tested positive, USADA went after him because they built a case based on testimony. They eventually had samples that showed evidence of PED use, but still never a positive sample. ASADA is doing the same here. They know the people involved, they know the substances used, they apparently know how they're getting into the country, somewhere in the middle of all this is the truth and either way it doesn't look pretty. Not just for Cronulla, or the NRL but Australian sport as a whole.

It's amazing that Danks spent 5 years at Manly without putting a foot wrong and then went to the Sharks for a month and decided he would start using these practices.

Now you have done it, be prepared to receive the following "How would you like people to start throwing bullsh!t out about your spinless dragons (West Tigers) your just as bad as the labour stooges"

Dr Grange said:

You need to stop smoking that weed it's starting to cloud you vision & thoughts.
How would you like people to start throwing bullsh!t out about your spinless dragons your just as bad as the labour stooges.
Get some facts 1st !!!!!

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You sir are the biggest idiot on the forum. I guess you don't understand the word "rumour"

The lack of due process in this whole thing is disturbing. You would find accused murderers that get better treatment than these players.

The more I read its clear that ASADA are just after a scalp to justify themselves and the poor management structure at the Sharks has made them easier targets than going after Manly, Newcastle, Penrith or Essendon for that matter.

More interesting news on the Sharks....

Cronulla Sharks players have allegedly received under-the-table payments from a security company sponsor, opening another battle front for the club at the centre of an investigation by the Australian Sports Anti-Doping Agency.
Fairfax Media has confirmed the Sharks have recently severed ties with the company E Group Security, which was a sponsor and provided security to the club, and replaced it with another security firm.
However, it has been alleged once the club realised the company, run by former rugby league player Sami Chamoun, had allegedly helped to top up the money for its star players outside the salary cap, the board went into panic mode.
The club informed the NRL's salary cap auditor when it became aware of the allegations, and the auditor is investigating the claims.
A breach of the cap on payments to players is a serious offence under NRL membership rules, and crippled Melbourne Storm when its breaches became public.
The dispute with its sponsor is the last thing the Cronulla club needs on the back of allegations levelled at it by ASADA and Friday's sacking of four senior staff members and the decision to stand coach Shane Flanagan down.

Its a conspiracy to get rid of yhe Sharks and move them to Perth!!!!

this is the whole article

Cronulla Sharks players have allegedly received under-the-table payments from a security company sponsor, opening another battle front for the club at the centre of an investigation by the Australian Sports Anti-Doping Agency.
Fairfax Media has confirmed the Sharks have recently severed ties with the company E Group Security, which was a sponsor and provided security to the club, and replaced it with another security firm.
However, it has been alleged once the club realised the company, run by former rugby league player Sami Chamoun, had allegedly helped to top up the money for its star players outside the salary cap, the board went into panic mode.
The club informed the NRL's salary cap auditor when it became aware of the allegations, and the auditor is investigating the claims.
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A breach of the cap on payments to players is a serious offence under NRL membership rules, and crippled Melbourne Storm when its breaches became public.
The dispute with its sponsor is the last thing the Cronulla club needs on the back of allegations levelled at it by ASADA and Friday's sacking of four senior staff members and the decision to stand coach Shane Flanagan down.
Mr Chamoun, 37, confirmed his security company had lost its contract with the Sharks despite having two years left to run. His lawyers had written to the Sharks on Friday informing them they were taking legal action for a breach of contract.
''As part of the contract there was a sponsorship component with the club which we kept to,'' he told Fairfax Media. ''There's a lot more to it than that. I really can't say too much yet. We only served the letter with them on Friday and we want to give them the chance to respond.''
Asked if he had paid Sharks players directly instead of the club, Mr Chamoun said: ''I never said that.''
The Sharks, including chairman Damian Irvine and suspended coach Flanagan, denied there were any inappropriate payments made by Mr Chamoun while the head of Cronulla's commercial operations Patrick Woods said he had no comment at all.
''We changed security companies for this season and an ongoing contractual dispute with our previous contractors eventuates,'' Irvine said in a text sent from Los Angeles. ''The NRL salary cap auditor was informed of their inference when they were made and asked to ensure all payments were correctly registered.''
It was understood the club called an emergency meeting two weeks ago to discus the matter, and the possible ramifications. Apart from lawyers, Flanagan and skipper Paul Gallen were said to have attended.
Flanagan, who was sensationally suspended on Friday, was incensed by the story, saying it was something he did not want to get caught up in. ''I'm not getting into rubbish talk like that,'' he said. ''The rumour, I've heard it, but I'm not going down there now. I have more things to worry about.''
Mr Chamoun, a former front-rower for the Illawarra Steelers in the 1990s, established E Group Security in late 2004. The business boasts more than 1000 staff and provides security and cleaning services to more than 200 clients, which include the NSW government and the City of Sydney. It also does work for a number of other NRL teams, including the Wests Tigers, Penrith Panthers, Sydney Roosters and Newcastle Knights. It also counts the NRL and Parramatta Stadium among its clients.
Mr Chamoun runs the company out of an office in Petersham.
The Sharks open their NRL season on Sunday night with a home clash against the Gold Coast Titans. They were listed as one of the pre-season favourites for the premiership in 2013 but the major setbacks suffered over the past week will be a huge hurdle to overcome to break the club's long-running title drought.


Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/sport/shark-at...#ixzz2N50euMY0